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  • Holocrystals

    I see no one saw fit to post about the Holocrystal mailout from B5 Books. I honestly didn't know weather to hold my tongue about this one or not, but I think they've jumped the shark with this offering. It's the only item that's ever left me facepalming. The Garibaldi one, whilst very well intentioned, also had much the same affect on me. I tend to think the books are great, but this just feels like a tacky cash in (for me at least). I guess I'll vote with my wallet, this one isn't for me, clearly.

    Is anyone in the market for an item like this!?! I just don't get the appeal.
    Last edited by Ubik; 12-11-2018, 02:47 PM.
    Captain John Sheridan: I really *hate* it when you do that.

    Kosh: Good!

  • #2
    I think I understand why they do this sort of thing. As best as I can tell they're not an official WB licence holder. . . . they're (studio) official as someone who sells t-shirts. They're just tarted up to look like an official site (or group) because jms gave them permission to sell stuff involving his words - so they are official when it comes to his stuff. . . . A certain degree of copyright theft is tolerated (some contributors to the scrolls - which is covered by fair use, really can't understand why I haven't done a book for example), but playing too often in WB sandpit by selling stuff they have no rights to could get them noticed - which is why they only dip their toe into things like the [email protected] book. . . Other stuff involving the writers, the fans, and the actors don't need permission from - or payment to - the studio. . . I could be wrong, but it explains a lot, including the tacky use of quotes in things like these resin "crystals".

    It's like Jan when she did stuff for the FreeBabylon5 campaign, the second she sold something like those wrist bands with the B5 name or station on it she was technically committing copyright theft . . . but at the same time she could say they were official material . . . but only for the campaign.
    Last edited by Triple F; 12-12-2018, 04:22 AM.

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    • #3
      I have absolutely no idea what the license arrangements are tbh, or if they are required for those products mentioned. I'm just not mad keen on the Holocrystal thing. Feels tacky to me.
      Captain John Sheridan: I really *hate* it when you do that.

      Kosh: Good!

      Comment


      • #4
        Only mentioned the (possible) licence thing as it could help explain the limited material they can safely produce. They did the scripts, they did the quotes, they did the Q&A's, etc but where to go from there. But I agree, it comes across as a simple cash-in on fans looking for what they think at least is official material. Horses for courses. Some will love it, which is fair enough. . . such is fandom.

        I think they lost me around this time.

        http://www.firstones.net/forums/inde...comment/256076

        Last edited by Triple F; 12-12-2018, 06:13 AM.

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        • #5
          Due to the Separation of Rights agreement in the WGA contract, JMS has control over those scripts and anything he'd like to do with them. And of course the A&A books were his material. Which we've discussed a number of times, Triple F.

          Why didn't I post anything about them here? I forgot. It wasn't a matter of 'seeing fit', it was a simple human error.

          If you like them, get them. If you don't, don't. I like that they're smaller than the Garibaldi crystal so likely to be more useful as paperweights and such. Looking forward to seeing it in person.
          "Fascism always comes in quietly, holding a flag in one hand and a holy book in the other, inching its way in. The bugles and drums only sound after they've already taken over and believe it's too late to do anything about it." JMS Twitter Dec. 24, 2017

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Jan View Post
            Which we've discussed a number of times, Triple F.
            Yes Jan, I know. I was there. : ) There's no question they can produce (official) stuff for jms using what jms holds rights over - they're never was one on my part . . I've mentioned that a number of times. Anyway, a little dancing over the lines is allowed (if that's indeed what they sometimes do) and no bad thing for the most part if it is . . . but can result in a limited range of what they'll produce. Then again, the whole collecting of any kind of merchandise has always pretty much passed me by anyway. Did anyone else see those bed sheets kicking around with ships printed on them . . . .
            Last edited by Triple F; 12-12-2018, 09:16 AM.

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            • #7
              Yeah, saw the sheets and shirts and somebody's even selling towels with the sword-and-shield logo.
              "Fascism always comes in quietly, holding a flag in one hand and a holy book in the other, inching its way in. The bugles and drums only sound after they've already taken over and believe it's too late to do anything about it." JMS Twitter Dec. 24, 2017

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              • #8
                Oh man, I used to have a TNG bedspread when I was 13. Truth.
                Captain John Sheridan: I really *hate* it when you do that.

                Kosh: Good!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Triple F View Post
                  It's like Jan when she did stuff for the FreeBabylon5 campaign, the second she sold something like those wrist bands with the B5 name or station on it she was technically committing copyright theft . . . but at the same time she could say they were official material . . . but only for the campaign.
                  Thought about this a bit. First off, yes, I probably did infringe when it came to my banners and buttons for #FreeBabylon5. But I sure as heck didn't sell any wristbands back then and even now, when I do it's not infringement or "theft" as you say, in any way. One cannot copyright a title and I'm not even using any images from the show - only a silhouette or line drawing on both the wristbands and dogtags. So, nope, no infringement. Not even using the B5 font (which isn't trademarked, anyway, being available in any font package). Just for the sake of accuracy...
                  "Fascism always comes in quietly, holding a flag in one hand and a holy book in the other, inching its way in. The bugles and drums only sound after they've already taken over and believe it's too late to do anything about it." JMS Twitter Dec. 24, 2017

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                  • #10
                    Only mentioned it as an example of how easy it is to wander into "technically" infringing waters, even with the best of intentions, whether it be copyright or trademark . . . and how something like the word official can be used. Here's one of the photo's on the FreeBabylon5 page from back in 2014 relating to the sale of stuff back then using specific B5 related images and designs - rather than the more recent wrist bands (which were a poor example on my part.)

                    https://www.facebook.com/FreeBabylon...type=3&theater

                    As I said, wasn't meant as anything other than an example. If many laws (and rules) were persued to the strictest of letters, we'd all be pretty screwed pretty much on a daily basis . . . . which isn't all that bad now that I think about it. . . Where was I. Oh yeah. Hell, remember the time some firefly fans were sent C&D's just for making and selling hats that looked like the one worn by "Jayne".

                    Ubik. To steal a quote from Firefly . . . Man walks down the street in that bedspread, people know he's not afraid of anything. : )
                    Last edited by Triple F; 12-12-2018, 08:39 PM.

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                    • #11
                      Ubik. To steal a quote from Firefly . . . Man walks down the street in that bedspread, people know he's not afraid of anything. : )[/QUOTE]

                      Hahahaha. I loved that bedspread.

                      Captain John Sheridan: I really *hate* it when you do that.

                      Kosh: Good!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Triple F View Post
                        Only mentioned it as an example of how easy it is to wander into "technically" infringing waters, even with the best of intentions, whether it be copyright or trademark . . . and how something like the word official can be used. Here's one of the photo's on the FreeBabylon5 page from back in 2014 relating to the sale of stuff back then using specific B5 related images and designs - rather than the more recent wrist bands (which were a poor example on my part.)
                        Reasonably sure that neither I nor B5 books have used the word 'official' for campaigns (me) or merchandise (B5 books). Just saying...
                        "Fascism always comes in quietly, holding a flag in one hand and a holy book in the other, inching its way in. The bugles and drums only sound after they've already taken over and believe it's too late to do anything about it." JMS Twitter Dec. 24, 2017

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                        • #13
                          Talking about merchandising. All i know is that i want those :
                          - https://forums.jmsnews.com/forum/dis...ini-sculptures

                          Kosh and the Shadow are so cute !!!
                          They are not for sale though... T_T

                          More seriously i must admit I didn't pay much attention to "official" terms being or not on the B5Books releases because it is/was the scripts and/or the interviews : it was implied to me that to publish them, you must have the rights and approval to do so by the writer/interviewer, especially if the writer is writing commentaries and introductions.
                          Not knowing about B5Books until last year, I just checked at first that it wasn't one of these publishers that create content based on wikipedia entries and then sell them, and that there wasn't any declaration of the writer/interviewer saying "they publish my work without any proper consent !" and found out that on the contrary, it was totally endorsed.
                          So I don't think i have ever saw the word "official" on B5Books releases, but since that it was "legit" and that they were working with JMS/the actors etc..., it was enough for me to trust them, I just regret now having not know them before so i could have buy them with the debut discount/when they were available.

                          I can understand that about the holocrystals though, it can be confusing,
                          but, as it is said in the FAQ :

                          HOW DO I KNOW THESE AUTOGRAPHS ARE THE REAL DEAL?
                          Ask any of the actors via social media or email and they will confirm that "yes," these are the real deal. We've been in business for more than 13 years and have worked with most of the actors extensively. We've gotten questions about the "Vir" crystal: we actually started this project a while back, before Stephen "Vir" Furst passed away.
                          So it doesn't matter if there is the word "official" or not, it is a "real" autograph of the B5 cast, made volunteerly by them to be in these crystals, so their participation is "official".

                          About the holocrystals, i will pass on them because i like the autographs to be :
                          - either on a book (B5-20, B5 novels, convention books, Vol 15, etc...)
                          - or on something else BUT related to a special moment where you can actually meet the actor and spend a little time with, and create a particular memory

                          But this is just me, and i can understand that some fans will like to have in a single buy all those autographs, especially the ones of Stephen Furst.
                          I think it is something that can be cool to offer to a B5 Fan for Christmas : "here is a autographed item by this B5 actor you like" for example.

                          All i know is that as i was looking at the page at first, I felt a little emotional/sad because I realized that, of course, you don't have the autograph crystals of G'Kar, Franklin, Sinclair and Zathras, and it reminds you of the members of the cast that passed the Rim...
                          Last edited by Apsu; 12-14-2018, 01:08 AM.
                          "Ahh...Beautiful. I will miss this. When it is gone." Kosh Naranek - 26 February, 2258.

                          https://babylon5.xyz

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                          • #14
                            I agree with you about autographs. I'm not a big one for them but when I did get them it was in part to thank/encourage the actors for coming to the conventions. For others who can't or don't get to cons I like that these are accompanied by favorite quotes by the characters.
                            "Fascism always comes in quietly, holding a flag in one hand and a holy book in the other, inching its way in. The bugles and drums only sound after they've already taken over and believe it's too late to do anything about it." JMS Twitter Dec. 24, 2017

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