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  • #46
    Are we really fighting over some perceived possible contents of a show that's not going to happen? And over whether or not he should have said there's something going on at all? Technically, he did fulfill having something to say, it's just his something to say was "it was close, the deal died." Kinda cool that we have a creator who respects us enough to give us those specifics.
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    • #47
      Originally posted by KoshN View Post
      IF the B5 project whose venue "never materialized" was "Babylon 5" reboot, I'm OVERJOYED that it's dead. "Babylon 5" does not need a reboot. I wonder how they got JMS to drink the Kool Aid.
      Seriously, it is time to start building a snow fort in Hell, and watching the cats lie down with the dogs, because I am AGAIN finding myself in agreement with Mac. :-)

      By the way, if any of you have XM or Sirius, they were using channel 141 as the Comic-Con channel for a few days, and I was listening to content as late as this afternoon (including the Superman panel that included JMS). I only found it because I have a friend who's on-air talent on XM's Book Radio, and they sent her to SDCC to do interviews, so I tuned in to hear what she was up to...and was pleasantly surprised to hear her broadcasting from the Superman panel today (well, it was on Saturday, but they re-aired it today). Anyway, they might still be airing stuff if you're interested to listen.

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      • #48
        People kept asking JMS on facebook and elsewhere if there will be more B5, or if there is anything planned. He always gets asked that at every convention as well. So he's not gonna lie is he, if something is going on. He can say "no comment", but who isn't smart enough to realize it would also mean "yes, there is something going on."

        And regarding a reboot, if a reboot or no B5 at all are the options, I'll go for a reboot. For some reason people are using it as a curse word. I see no reason for that. All that matters is if the show/movie is good.

        Didn't hurt the Batman films none. Was the best thing they could've done.

        As for people complaining about getting the same story again, I don't believe for a second it would be. How close was the new BSG to the old one? Like night and day.

        And JMS often gets asked if he would do things differently if he made B5 now, and he says yes, he's not the same writer now as he was then. Besides, even the original B5 didn't turn out exactly the way he wanted, he said it's about 80% of what he intended. So the story would be new.

        So you can either bitch and moan about not getting any new B5 and keep watching your old DVD's over and over again. Or you can bitch and moan and watch the DVD's AND a brand new modern version of B5 on TV, with a different story. The new version won't erase your DVD's.

        My favorite part about such a prospect would be, that after a 5 year storyline of the B5 story, we'd maybe finally get an additional 5 years of Crusade, at long last. What an absolute disgrace that would be, eh?

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        • #49
          Just a quick, off-topic comment. I absolutely hate, abhor and despise the current phrase "drink the Kool Aid" used to mean simply 'go along with it'. Don't people remember that it harkens back to a horrid tragedy where *hundreds* of people died?

          Jan
          "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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          • #50
            Nonsense

            JMS doesn't owe us anything, but you know what? I don't owe him anything. He's jerked around and played the fans too many times. This collapsed B5 project comes as no surprise. However leading and teasing the fans is something that, at this point in the game, does come as a surprise. I'm tired of this nonsense. B5 stopped being fun along time ago. There are many new things out there, as a science fiction fan, to be excited about. Life is to short for this nonsense.

            And for those who may not know. My wife and I lead the fight to save "Crusade" 12 years ago. Been down this road before.

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            • #51
              As someone who has a script on option, I can say there's always an urge to say something about it, because you want people to know what you're working on, and you want them to be as excited as you are. I also know how unlikely my option is actually to go through, but that doesn't stop that little hope from burning through and coloring my excitement and urge to tell people about it. So, WB tells Joe, "hey we have this cool thing, and we've got some Babylon 5 stuff you can do, and we're going to give you a budget, and a season, and everything you want, just wait for this other contract to go through"; so yeah, he's excited about this, but he kept saying to us, "I won't know until later. There's nothing concrete at this time. I don't know yet. Ask me later." I think it's a little silly to expect him to never say anything about it. He's only human.
              Last edited by JoeD80; 07-25-2011, 10:39 PM.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by JoeD80 View Post
                As someone who has a script on option, I can say there's always an urge to say something about it, because you want people to know what you're working on, and you want them to be as excited as you are. I also know how unlikely my option is actually to go through, but that doesn't stop that little hope from burning through and coloring my excitement and urge to tell people about it. So, WB tells Joe, "hey we have this cool thing, and we've got some Babylon 5 stuff you can do, and we're going to give you a budget, and a season, and everything you want, just wait for this other contract to go through"; so yeah, he's excited about this, but he kept saying to us, "I won't know until later. There's nothing concrete at this time. I don't know yet. Ask me later." I think it's a little silly to expect him to never say anything about it. He's only human.
                Yes but Joe, that's one of the points that I was hoping to put across, the fact that he's been down this road more than once and he still, to a certain extent, lead us (the fans) into no small measure of excitement. With all of his Hollywood experience now, I really think that he should have known better than to say anything at all if the distribution system (whatever the hell that means) 'deal' such as it was, had yet to be set in concrete.

                How you get to see something, in this case, proved to be more important than the actual shows (whatever new B5 included) themselves, so with that gone, all the hints, hopes and expectations were for nought.

                Edit: One has to hope that the other B5 project that is in talks, still has all of his prerequisites attached, namely a good budget, total creative control, commitment to a full production, or does that go without saying? I am genuinely confused as he had all of these anyway and the project still did not materialise, can he still ask for these for the 'new' new deal?

                You've an optioned script? Now that is cool. Well done!! I hope it works out for you.
                Last edited by DGTWoodward; 07-26-2011, 12:19 AM. Reason: Bda selpling miskates + additional thought...
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                • #53
                  The difference between the reboots of Batman, Trek and others is that the story was never really told to begin with. Burton's Batman doesn't go into Bruce's training and the fact Joe Chill not Jack Napier killed his parents. Trek never really told the story of how Kirk got the Enterprise in a visual format. The book for it was terrible, three words: Traveling Space Circus. BSG was a pretty terrible show and made into an ok show. So, the reboots that have been successful are usually the ones where we have never really seen the beginning and if we did it was pretty awful.

                  The other point is Babylon 5 is all about the story. Its like someone rebooting LOTR or Star Wars. We already know the story and love it, why try to do it again. So we get Tom Bomadill, the Jar Jar Binks of LOTR in or have Obi be Luke's father? Rebooting those stories is just stupid at this point as is rebooting B5. What else does he want to tell? Is that 20% worth going back and doing? I would guess probably not. If anything I hope reboot meant something like B5: The Next Generation which could be done.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by DGTWoodward View Post
                    Yes but Joe, that's one of the points that I was hoping to put across, the fact that he's been down this road more than once and he still, to a certain extent, lead us (the fans) into no small measure of excitement. With all of his Hollywood experience now, I really think that he should have known better than to say anything at all ...
                    You might be right on that, but the problem is that the only reason he says anything at all is that every time he attends a convention, or interacts on the newsgroup or Twitter, fans ask whether there is any new B5 in the works and, having witnessed Joe's online interaction over the last 13 years or so, the last thing I would expect him to do is flat out lie to the fans that there is nothing in the offing when discussions are going on in the background.

                    Maybe he should lie and say there is nothing going on, but that is for him to decide.
                    The Optimist: The glass is half full
                    The Pessimist: The glass is half empty
                    The Engineer: The glass is twice as big as it needs to be

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                    • #55
                      It's a no-win situation. If JMS says something is in the works and will announce it when a deal is made, the fans start another endless debate about what that project might be, what it can't be, what they want to see, etc. And when Joe finally discloses that he was negotiating with WB about a possible B5 re-boot, it launches another wave of discussion and speculation, much of it from people arguing at cross purposes because they don't know what the word 're-boot' means. In some ways, I agree with Garibaldi's Hair that it might almost be better to wait until a deal is signed before announcing it, but we all know that ain't gonna happen.

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                      • #56
                        To G'sH...There is no lie in saying something along the lines of...

                        "Given my history with the title, I will always be looking for a big new B5 project, but there is nothing to tell you at the moment"

                        ...which is most definitely not a lie, and also happens to be the complete truth.

                        To JoeN...You see, by my reasoning, this 'other B5 project that is still in early negotiation' should have remained a quiet potential thing of the future. He should have said nothing on it, because given the past, it will probably dissolve into nothingness too.

                        I hope I am wrong JN, I really do. In the whole sea of mediocre crap, BABYLON 5 surfaced out of nowhere and slapped the TV world in the face, just by being REALLY good and for a fraction of the cost of previous shows.
                        Last edited by DGTWoodward; 07-28-2011, 12:36 AM. Reason: Spelling.
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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by AmyG View Post
                          Seriously, it is time to start building a snow fort in Hell, and watching the cats lie down with the dogs, because I am AGAIN finding myself in agreement with Mac. :-)


                          Originally posted by DGTWoodward View Post
                          To G'sH...There is no lie in saying something along the lines of...

                          "Given my history with the title, I will always be looking for a big new B5 project, but there is nothing to tell you at the moment"

                          ...which is most definately not a lie, and also happens to be the complete truth.

                          To JoeN...You see, by my reasoning, this 'other B5 project that is still in early negotiation' should have remained a quiet potential thing of the future. He should have said nothing on it, because given the past, it will probably dissolve into nothingness too.

                          I hope I am wrong JN, I really do. In the whole sea of mediacore crap, BABYLON 5 surfaced out of nowhere and slapped the TV world in the face, just by being REALLY good and for a fraction of the cost of previous shows.
                          Agreed on all counts.
                          Mac Breck (KoshN)
                          ------------------
                          Warner Brothers is Lucy.
                          JMS and we fans are collectively Charlie Brown.
                          Babylon 5 is the football.

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                          • #58
                            To "reboot Babylon 5"

                            and

                            "a Babyon 5 reboot"

                            to me are two different things. I certainly hope he isn't planning on starting over from scratch (the second interpretation.) Yes, he got d*cked around by the network quite a bit, so maybe there's some merit to the ideas. But, how can you top Andreas? I think Joe has too much respect for the work that's already been done to do that. (And personally, reading his original story arc...I liked what happened on screen MUCH better.)

                            Personally, I read this as a re-ignition of the franchise from a ground-zero. Whatever's in the works is meant to appeal to a whole new generation, not just the fans of a nearly twenty-year-old show.

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                            • #59
                              A difference I singularly fail to see...

                              These are different? They are almost identically the same words but in an ever-so-slightly different order.

                              Joe could indeed do many things, there are a HUGE numbers of stories still to tell in the B5 universe, but if his idea was to go back to year one, have the same characters, but telling a different story...

                              in other words, a START TREK XI style reboot,

                              ...then he would have lost me anyway.

                              Edit: Wikipedia's definition of the word 'Reboot' as pertaining to TV/Film

                              PS Even using JN's idea of 'rebooting his computer'...you only usually do this to 1) add updates to something that already exists or 2) solve a problem that has developed (in this case, how do we get some new B5?) and where you need to go back to a point before the problem and return/rewind the machine to that point, thereby erasing all that lead to that point to begin with.

                              In B5 terms....number one would just be a straight sequel, and he's already tried that, more than once, without any real ongoing success.

                              So that only leaves number two....
                              Last edited by DGTWoodward; 07-28-2011, 12:57 AM. Reason: Added extra info...
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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by falstaffe View Post
                                But, how can you top Andreas?
                                You can't.

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