Day of the Dead - literally???

[Kris79]

Hi Babylonians an all,

Just wondering what you thought of the episode "Day of the Dead"?

It was written by Neil Gaimen (to whom I like a lot). Thought it was an interesting episode. Must go back and watch it again though as I'm still not getting it as to why Morden appeared to Lennier and what all that was about.

Plus, if the Brakiri in some way possessed the ability to block off the station or as was almost explained shift it to their homeworld, could they not have used similar technology for other purposes like their defence against or conquering of other worlds??

Hmmm....

[Kloreep]

Must go back and watch it again though as I'm still not getting it as to why Morden appeared to Lennier and what all that was about.

It's pretty clear what the message was, but as to why Morden was the messenger... dunno.

Plus, if the Brakiri in some way possessed the ability to block off the station or as was almost explained shift it to their homeworld, could they not have used similar technology for other purposes like their defence against or conquering of other worlds??

Hmmm....

I think DotD falls in to the same category as the phrase "Beyond the Rim" and other similiar things. Sure, there's a literal meaning somewhere in there, but mainly it's not supposed to have a literal "this is a piece of technology and it could really happen" aspect to it.

[Andrew_Swallow]

It was written by Neil Gaimen (to whom I like a lot). Thought it was an interesting episode. Must go back and watch it again though as I'm still not getting it as to why Morden appeared to Lennier and what all that was about.

Same rank.
Morden was the Shadows champion. (Justin was his boss.)
Lennier played the Lancelot role - Delenn and the Vorlons champion.

[JDSValen]

For me, it was so-so.

I liked how they used this experience to further characterize Lochley. Because they were only gonna get 1 season to play with her, they needed to have the audience care about her just as much as the previously established characters, and this ep greatly helped in that regard.

I loved the message from Kosh. Probably my favorite part of the ep. I bought the script off of Neil Gaiman's site and in it he said that he knew JMS was looking to put that message somewhere that season so he wrote the ep with that in mind and then let JMS write that scene. (Part of me thinks that they should've edited that line into SiL, like they did with the other flashbacks, but the other part thinks that that ep is perfect. I'm so conflicted!)

Rebo and Zooty just seemed silly and out of place to me.

Also, one thing that has always bugged me about this ep is I always thought it should have aired before Phoenix Rising, mainly because of Garibaldi. He starts drinking again in Rising but is suddenly sober in Dead. It makes no sense. Dead was FILMED before Rising, but for some reason it AIRED after, and Garibaldi just doesn't fit.

As I said, so-so.

[WorkerCaste]

I really enjoyed the ep. It was a nice change of pace. Also, having seen Penn and Teller live and in person, it was a kick seeing them on my favorite TV show. I also like having a little mystery -- not knowing exactly what happened or how. As far as Morden appearing to Lennier, I don't have a real good guess, but it was Neil Gaiman's choice. JMS had this to say...

http://jmsnews.com/msg.aspx?id=1-10521

I always kind of thought that Lennier received the darkest message, so he needed a dark messenger. If you accept that, who could it have been? Lennier probably didn't know any real dark personalities while he studied at temple, and even on B5, he didn't run into too many sinister people who subsequently died.

[Dauriel]

It's one of my favorite episodes for a few reasons.

Being written by Neil Gaiman, one of my favorite authors, it definitely makes my list. He did a nice job putting in a supernatural element to the show that still made it believeable.

I wasn't sure about Rebo and Zooty at first, but having Penn and Teller on made it all worthwhile. Having them on, balanced the episode nicely between the heavier and lighter elements.

I guess the main reason it hit me so hard was that it gave a few Londo, Garabaldi and Lochley something not all of us get in life. It gave them closure in a certain part of their lives. Relationships with people end in many ways, and not all of them end with closure. There are unanswered questions, unresolved issues, or just a second chance to say goodbye. At the time when this episode aired, I had an ending of a relationship that ended abruptly. There are times when I wish I did have that second chance to get closure with him. I still get a bit choked up when Dodger quotes to Garabaldi "Parting is all we know of Heaven, and all we need to know of Hell."

Plus it was nice to see Morden again...

[modernmajorgeneral]

Perhaps the dimensional gate seen in Day of the Dead is another one of those odd bits of Ancients tech that we so often see turning up in B5, Crusade, and the novels. As usual with this kind of thing, it often works as a "black box" where the operator can elicit an effect from a device without fully understanding its governing principles. An example would be our telephones; we use them routinely, but few of us can describe their inner workings in significant quantitative or even qualitative terms. It would seem strange that JMS would introduce such a science and continuity bender as a mere plot device without having devised some rational or logical origin for it in the context of the overall B5 arc. He may not have shown all of his cards in employing the dimensional gate, but I imagine the rhyme and reason of the device exists in JMS' head.

[Andrew_Swallow]

How part of Babylon 5 got transported back to the Brakiri home world was never explained. No gate device was shown.

[modernmajorgeneral]

How part of Babylon 5 got transported back to the Brakiri home world was never explained. No gate device was shown.

Granted, Andrew, but it would serve as an explanation that fits the technical dimension and story parameters of B5. As long as we're in speculative mode as to the nature of the section's transport, let us consider the role of the Ancients in the overall B5 storyline. The Ancient races act as patrons/teachers/manipulators of the younger species. Perhaps the Brakiri Day of the Dead had its origins in the tutelage of the Ancients. For my part I see a strong thematic connection between Day of the Dead and Soulhunter/River of Souls. Consider the spiritual implications of a visitation from the departed. Maybe the Soulhunters had something to do with it. Maybe the Shadows...Maybe the Vorlons...I acknowledge that the Ancients finally buggered off after the Shadow War, but this could have served as a last farewell. The events of Day of the Dead exerted a powerful influence on several B5 characters, even prompting Garibaldi to question his atheism. Straczynski was always careful to leave room for interpretation on the more metaphysical elements of the stories, never clobbering the audience over the head with a lengthy exposition on the exact nature of spiritual phenomena. As a good storyteller, JMS left several unanswered questions and loose ends with this episode. But this is part of the fun in participating in a web board such as this...

[AmyG]

Hi, Kris,

I liked the episode a lot, but have one big nitpick about it: I'm irked by the way Gaiman portrayed G'Kar as being reticent to participate. Sure, he says later that he regrets it, but I just don't think that G'Kar's panicky retreat to C&C in the face of a potentially life-changing spiritual experience rings true.

As to why Lennier gets Morden, obviously it's because that's what Gaiman wrote...but I think there's some good sense and balance to it. Morden started out life as a good person, a rule-follower, learning his craft and going to Z'ha'dum with the best of intentions. Given a choice (death, or life as a CPU in a Shadow ship, or cooperation with the Shadows), he chose badly - because of a woman (spoiler for the Technomage trilogy: okay, really because of two people, his family, who he thought he was saving from having to re-experience the moment of their death over and over). Lennier's path was similar.

Regarding the Brakiri "shifting" technology, I agree with others who say that it isn't, strictly speaking, a "technology." I think that it's an unexplained spiritual phenomenon that occurs only on the Day of the Dead, and that it likely wouldn't work if they tried to employ it for defense, or offense, even if they did so on the Day of the Dead.

Amy

[Dr Maturin]

I liked the episode a lot, but have one big nitpick about it: I'm irked by the way Gaiman portrayed G'Kar as being reticent to participate. Sure, he says later that he regrets it, but I just don't think that G'Kar's panicky retreat to C&C in the face of a potentially life-changing spiritual experience rings true

Well, I just watched CoLaD last night and G'kar refused to take part in the rebirth ceremony. He had already been born once. Maybe the fact that he had already had a spiritual experience with someone that was dead a few years before was also a factor in his refusal to take part in DotD. Maybe he didn't want to trivialize its specialness by purposely taking part in a ritual to speak with the dead.

Or maybe he didn't want to be contacted by Na'Toth due to the pain?

I once went to a Mexican-American Day of the Dead ritual. Nothing supernatural like on B5, but really weird nonetheless.

[Towelmaster]

How part of Babylon 5 got transported back to the Brakiri home world was never explained. No gate device was shown.

Why should everything be explained and analyzed in the story?
Isn't it true that there are many many things we do not yet understand? I strongly suspect that this will be the case a few hundred years from now. From what I saw, the phenomenon in tDotD occurs only once in every twohundred years and is not explained or logically interpreted.
It just is. One of those mysteries of life. Something that may one day be understood. Or not...

[AmyG]

Well, I just watched CoLaD last night and G'kar refused to take part in the rebirth ceremony. He had already been born once.

Actually, in "Ceremonies of Light and Dark," G'Kar's main reason for not participating in the rebirth ceremony is that he's so busy running station security with the Narns, which he's just begun doing. This is his chance to do something for Sheridan so that he'll let him into the War Council, remember. I think that his comment about having "already been born once" was more of a flip aside, said by someone too busy to argue about it.

Also, remember that "Ceremonies" is two years prior to "Day of the Dead." A lot happens to G'Kar in those two years. I'm saying that I think that Gaiman's take on the G'Kar of 2262 is what doesn't ring true; the G'Kar of 2260 and the G'Kar of 2262 are somewhat different individuals.

Or maybe he didn't want to be contacted by Na'Toth due to the pain?

Doubtful, as Na'Toth isn't dead!

Amy

[Jan]

Doubtful, as Na'Toth isn't dead!

Yeah, but G'Kar doesn't know that yet.

Jan

[Dr Maturin]

Yeah, but G'Kar doesn't know that yet.

Got it in one, Jan!

<<Also, remember that "Ceremonies" is two years prior to "Day of the Dead." A lot happens to G'Kar in those two years.>>

I believe I mentioned as much. His experience in Dust to Dust was like the spiritual experience of spiritual experiences. Some little ceremony held by the Brakiri was nothing to someone who experienced what he did.