Crusade failure

[Ranger1]

I remember when Crusade was first aired here,i was so excited,i remember the first episode really blew my mind and i was "oh yeah baby"....then episode 2 came...and to be frank...it went from that point on real slow,lets be realistic,most people who watched that show were Babylon 5 fans,or people who saw B5 and liked it.

For me the sets....there were so many sections that were looking like a studio..like when Galen is sitting with his technomages....i dont know i just remember seeing it for the first time i went like....ewwww....i mean B5 had a wonderful buzz and won awards,and they coudlnt build better sets that..well...dont look like sets?
other then that the story went pretty slow from episode 2,we were already got used to the fast paste of B5 season 3-4,and now we get season 1 all over again just with different cast and story.
Post here on why you didnt like Crisade.

[OmahaStar]

Re: Crusade failure

Originally posted by Ranger1
Post here on why you didnt like Crisade.

No. Thanks. I happen to like Crusade. And that's how it is spelled, FYI. If you're going to sit there and bash a show, at least have the common courtesy to spell the name of the program correctly.

[Jan]

Sorry-I don't agree

Sorry, no takers here. I liked Crusade and am only disappointed that it never had a chance to meet it's potential.

By the way, that first episode you liked so much was never even supposed to happen. It was a last minute demand by TNT when they changed their scheduling plans.

I will go so far as to say that there were a few episodes with less of an impact than I'd come to expect. If you read some of JMS' posts here, though, you'll find that he was trying to comromise with TNT who kept demanding story changes that ranged from stupid to offensive. That, in a nutshell, is exactly why the series was cancelled *before it ever was broadcast*. In the end, JMS had to say "No" to the demands.

The later episodes (greyish 'bellhop' uniforms) were the best of the episodes because they were the ones made without TNT interference.

You're upset about the sets? Maybe you should concentrate more on the story.

Jan

[Ranger1]

Re: Re: Crusade failure

Originally posted by OmahaStar
No. Thanks. I happen to like Crusade. And that's how it is spelled, FYI. If you're going to sit there and bash a show, at least have the common courtesy to spell the name of the program correctly.

are you stupid enough not to notice that the first Crusade that i wrote was fine? so i type fast and English is not my native language..lets see you try to type in Hebrew and then we will talk

[Ranger1]

Re: Sorry-I don't agree

Originally posted by Jan
You're upset about the sets? Maybe you should concentrate more on the story.

Jan

Sorry that doesnt work for me,in my point of view everything has to be right,starting with the story,cast,sound,SFX...everything.
Sorry but when i saw the Drakh's i thought im looking at reruns of old trek episodes from the 60's,the aliens on B5 were so beautiful,those Drakh's in Crusade looked like men with big bucket over their head.
And i asked you guys to post here why you dont like Crusade,so no need to kill me,if you dont have anything to say then dont reply to this thread.

[Jan]

Sorry that doesnt work for me,in my point of view everything has to be right,starting with the story,cast,sound,SFX...everything.

Oh, my. You must be disappointed a lot of the time, huh?

The Drakh on Crusade were a vast improvement over the one we saw on B5, that's for sure. Remember that? The thing was so poor that they had to fuzz the image in order to show it!

You compared Crusade to B5 but that's not actually a fair comparison because they were *financed* by two separate entities. JMS is well-known for bringing in the story on budget, unlike most SF series.

As for:

And i asked you guys to post here why you dont like Crusade,so no need to kill me,if you dont have anything to say then dont reply to this thread.

Why did you want to start such a negative thread anyway? Shouldn't these boards be open for discussion rather than bashing?

Jan

[Ranger1]

Isn't this also a sort of discussion? just want to raise out my opinion,but if you people just want to hear things that you like....consider this matter close.
Btw..the fuzz effects on the Drakh's in B5 was awesome,i can be honest and say i was really surprised seen that for the first time.

[Jan]

Isn't this also a sort of discussion? just want to raise out my opinion,but if you people just want to hear things that you like....consider this matter close.

Yes, it is a conversation. But previously you wrote:

And i asked you guys to post here why you dont like Crusade,so no need to kill me,if you dont have anything to say then dont reply to this thread.

So which do you want? Either you don't mind hearing viewpoints that disagree with yours and there's discussion or you do and you tell us not to post. Personally I have no problem with opposing views and love to discuss anything B5 any time. My main objection was the negative tone of your thread heading and post.

Btw..the fuzz effects on the Drakh's in B5 was awesome,i can be honest and say i was really surprised seen that for the first time.

It turned out pretty well, I agree. But it's still what JMS calls ABA - Art By Accident. From the Lurker's Guide for "Lines of Communication":

The real reason the Drakh shimmered, according to special effects technician Ken Busick, was that the costume didn't look convincing enough. So to give the Drakh an otherworldly appearance, the scene was digitally manipulated in postproduction.

Jan

[Vir]

Assuming Crusade was designed to last several seasons you cannot use all your best ideas in the first few episodes. You would be burnt out after the first season and following seasons would not live up to the first one.

I think the trick is to use just enough of your best ideas but hold back some for later seasons. That way you can bring in the better storylines gradually and give them a better build up for later episodes and make them more dramatic. ( if you remember the Shadows were introduced in season one of B5, but we dont get the Shadow war till the end of season 3 and season 4 )

For example watch series one of x-files, its not that great. Back then it was just a small cult tv show with only a small following, but look what it grew into.

Crusade was obviously starting off slowly deliberately. In my opinion this would be to give contrast to later seasons which I'm sure would have been outstanding. This must have been the most frustrating thing for JMS at having to cancel Crusade. He was never able to show everyone what it would grow into.

In my opinion it was a great start and was just beginning to pick up speed. ( interestingly I thought the episodes with Galen were better than the ones without )

[Ranger1]

Dont get me wrong guys (and girls),when Crusade is coming to DVD im getting it,i never said anything about the story been bad,only that it started (episode 2) slow,and yeah i guess there is logic when you say you can't keep all episodes so fast action pack/space battles,its just impossible (dont know why,IMO 30 minutes of kick a** CGI space battles and 10 minutes of dialog is pretty cool,but im just been sarcastic).
Just 1 thing bothered me as i said,some of the sets looked like "sets" not real environment/rooms.
Im not trying to bash the show itself.
Btw acting wise...it was brilliant.

[Jan]

Btw acting wise...it was brilliant.

I agree competely! I wasn't familiar with Gary Cole before that but I'll happily watch anything he's in. All of the actors were great, I think. I never had the feeling that I was watching an actor, always that I was seeing 'real' characters.

I do know what you mean about the sets, too. There were a couple of times when it was obvious that supposedly outdoor scenes were actually indoors. I think the problem was that it was set on a different planet every single week so they had to constantly re-do both the sets *and* all of the CGI. Expensive, to say the least.

So who was your favorite character?

Jan

[Ranger1]

Well,i must say Lochley...can't take my eyes out of her hihi
but lets take her aside and chose one of the Main cast i would have to say Gary Cole,when i was little there was a show with him...i really dont remember it or its name i tried IMDB but still can't find it,so when i saw him the first time on Crusade i went like "hey...i know that guy",and i love his acting.

[Mertu]

American Gothic?
Sort of Twin Peaks meets Steven King.

That's where I first noticed him (when Sci-Fi was showing reruns). He played the town sheriff, who was also evil/The Devil. He was great at being both the good guy and the bad guy at the same time.

[Ranger1]

I really dont remember,if i think hard enough im pretty sure it was an action mini series but again not sure.

[Vir]

I thought I remembered him from something called 'Midnight Caller' where he hosted a late night 'phone in' radio show. It was kind of action based.