TMoS is dead OFFICIAL THREAD

[Jan]

Hell, what's wrong with being pissed about it? A year ago, we all thought we were going to get a real, no compromise, big screen B5 movie. Now we're getting jack. Yes, I'd rather have no film at all if it's a choice between that and some studio-pleasing compromise - but that doesn't stop me being very disappointed. It's OK to grieve you know.

Absolutely it is. Maybe the full reaction hasn't set in yet, either.

Me, I'm starting to wonder about somebody who'd option a concept, commission a script and not be able to put the deal together in an entire year. One wonders if he/they were counting on WB to be the main backer all the time.

Jan

[Andrew_Swallow]

Me, I'm starting to wonder about somebody who'd option a concept, commission a script and not be able to put the deal together in an entire year. One wonders if he/they were counting on WB to be the main backer all the time.

They were first time film producers. They probably just did not realise how hard it is to raise large sums of money.

[AmyG]

Bummed. Sad. Disappointed. Anxious to see new material and familiar faces again.

It's like spending hours lovingly preparing a souffle, getting it safely into the oven, cooking it for the perfect amount of time, taking it carefully out of the oven....and it falls, anyway.

Oh, and did I say bummed?

COLOSSALLY bummed!

Amy

</weep>

[AmyG]

...and why he even mentioned the Warner brothers if the company was not a player) .

People keep misinterpreting this bit of information. Just because JMS owns the film rights himself doesn't mean that Warner Bros. wasn't at all involved on the funding or distribution side of things. JMS, not personally being a film studio, can't do it all himself!

Amy

[Andrew_Swallow]

Well, at the risk of sounding like I'm defending Warner Bros. or the accounting systems used by the studios generally - what they're doing isn't wholly irrational, nor, indeed, wholly unfair.

The studio puts up all the money for all of its projects. It is all coming out of one big pocket called "Warner Bros." All the profits ultimately go back into one big pocket as well. To say the "project A made a profit but project B lost money" is ultimately meaningless. The bottom line is that unless A made more than B lost, the studio as a whole lost money on the two. If they were the only two movies or TV shows that it made that year, it would be ludicrous if they didn't set B's loss against A's gain when calculating profit and loss. It would be incredibly unfair to the shareholders.
{snip}

This just means that financially the Hollywood studios are engineering companies. The research and development of products that do not sell have to be paid for by ones that do. Since the company knows how much it lost last year it can work out an hourly rate for each employee hired by a project. (Mine was 3 times what I was paid.) The same applies for cost centres like sound stages; this should cover indirect costs like security.

The day after the movie is sent for rating by the censor the producer should be sent a final bill. The marketing manager should get his at when the film has been on general release for a week.

[grumbler]

Disappointed but not bummed. I was expecting this to be the outcome, simply because things seemed to be going south in ways JMS couldn't even talk about.

Curious that the one thing we were all so wrong about was that this was a WB-backed picture undertaken because of the DVD sales. I will be interested in seeing the breakdown of the hints and what they meant when JMS can do so (like "the wrong side of the river" and why he even mentioned the Warner brothers if the company was not a player) .

Perhaps, in a way, this is good news. Maybe WB TV will be interested in looking at B5 again now that there is no competition, and those DVD sales numbers are still there....

After all, WB TV does have a network now.

[tlsmith1963]

Yes, my thanks also. The support and outpouring of ideas and initiative were nothing less than stunning and heartwarming.

There's even some small validation from JMS about the campaign, too. Answering a post from somebody claiming that the letter writing campaign was

less than pointless

JMS responded:

Your assumption is not valid. Which is all I can say for the moment.

So while we may never know what or how much of an effect we might have had, those who were telling us that we were silly or hysterical or wrong to do it were...incorrect. That's enough for me.

Jan

Could I have the entire quote from JMS & the person who said our campaign was pointless? I couldn't find it at the newsgroup. Or was there not much more than what you quoted?

Tammy

[Dr Maturin]

I haven't read this entire thread, so you'll excuse me if I am reiterating something that's already been said, but...we got five full seasons of one of the greatest sci-fi shows ever, and the greatest "spaceship show" ever. We got to see the characters grow and plots develop and come to closure. More importantly, we now have them on DVD.

TMoS would have been an extra goodie, but I am very happy with the series Babylon 5 and the excellent novels that fleshed out the universe.

We have Serenity, the Firefly movie, coming this Fall. It is a necessary movie because the series was cancelled. TMoS wasn't necessary, but rather a bonus, so to speak.

Any word on JMS' other B5 projects that were mentioned?

[Shr'eshhhhhh]

Typical!

I'm in the process of moving to Edinburgh for a while so I've been packing all my belongings away. I left out My B5 dvd sets to watch while in Scotland and realised I had just packed the entire series on video and loads of books and magazines and assorted B5 bits and bobs. I have spent a fortune on this show and supported it through the early days when everyone thought it was just a Star Trek rip off. And What do I get for my loyalty to this show, Crusade Cancelled, the Legend Of the Rangers (rubbish that never led anywhere) and finally this.

We Sci Fi fans are a little too patient I think.

In the last few years we've had to wait over a decade for Dr Who to come back. We've had 2 awful Star Wars films (don't get me started on George Lucas's cash cow milking technique) Farscape cancelled, Enterprise cancelled. While television becomes more like the sort of pap that Nigel Kneale predicted.

What's more TMoS cannot be made by someone else or be turned ino a novel or comic. Rubbish like Son of the Mask can get made (without Jim Carrey) but B5 movies must have big name stars.?

It makes me sick, we are ripped off left right and centre.

No wonder piracy flourishes. I wish I was a little less honest, perhaps I would have saved myself money and not given it to idiots who run WB's.

[PrimalScream1976]

asigh of relief

I was really happy that the studios tried to make JMS their way. As it looks JMS just told them to shove it. B5 is too inportant to our television viewing eyes to not have this come off as nothing moless that a spectacular home coming to a television series that boldly went....Oh, which brings up my next topic. Those RE-Tards over aint-it-cruel-news just made it even harder to say good bye. With their beloved Trek franchise taking a big 'ol dump in space dock it seems they would be willing to let JMS take a crack at it. But NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.....the genius that is Brannon Braga makes another in a long line of bone head decisions just as he did in the last 4 years with Trek. And now he has a chance to allow someone who can take the reins of a dieing franchise to its grave to be buried forever. Give JMS the chance he deserves. Dont be afraid hes going to kick your sorry behinds in the dirt Brannon. I hear that ALF and V are looking for new show runners. Heres to your last good bye as afar ar trek is concerned. Youve managed to single handedly destroy a vision that started40 years ago. Let JMS have his shot.

Thanks for leting me vent,

Youre truely,
Chris Hebert

[email protected]

[David Panzer]

Well, son of a b..... (The following sentences have been erased from all possible worlds and what follows is from a substitute poster.)

It took me forever to finally whittle away my letter to WB to a concise page and be original whilst containing the same message as thousands of other senders. This now confirms that I should've taken those welding classes in high school instead of going to college to study radio/tv and other forms of media.

[JackBauer]

Im not disapointed in this at all. Weve had our full TV show with all the tv movies to complement it. This would have been bonus. Imagine my disapointment when a show like Farscape is cancelled on a cliffhanger before i can end. THAT is disapointment, anger, hatred and all the rest.

[AmyG]

Could I have the entire quote from JMS & the person who said our campaign was pointless? I couldn't find it at the newsgroup. Or was there not much more than what you quoted?

Tammy, the post was in response to Chris Kocher - JMS quotes his relevant comment in his post, thus:

Subject: Re: additional from jms
From: [email protected]
Date: Today 2:45 AM
Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated

"So basically, all the letters and hype and hatred for Warner Bros.
over
the past six months was less than pointless, since they had no role in
the B5 movie at all.
Ironic, really, considering how much in a tizzy some pople were around
here."

Your assumption is not valid. Which is all I can say for the moment.

jms

HTH,

Amy

[grumbler]

No wonder piracy flourishes. I wish I was a little less honest, perhaps I would have saved myself money and not given it to idiots who run WB's.

Warners had little to nothing to do with this. TMoS was a private deal between JMS and a consortium (largely British, i gather) who wanted to do the film. WB let it be known early on, from my reading of things, that they were only interested in this if it was a 'star vehicle' and that is why, in the end, the people holding the rights (not JMS, not Warners) tried to recast it as a "star vehicle" in case they could save it by getting WB interested at the last minute. This effort failed.

It all was quite a bit diferent than we thought. I didn't understand why the independent producers didn't try to whip up some fan support. Surely, by playing coy, they cost themselvs the chance to whip up some fan ferver that could only do them good.

Their call, their loss. Presumably, they had their reasons.

[DGTWoodward]

Gutted, as you might expect.....

Well, what can you say? In the end no one won.

I find myself once again astounded by how things are done in HOLLYWOOD. B5 still in the red? Increasing viewing figures from season to season, world wide appeal and guarenteed merchandising sales ranging from calenders to models, and DVD sales that reached HALF A FRAGGIN' BILLION DOLLARS AND THE SHOW WAS STILL IN THE RED. Who was working the WB calculator...Stevie Wonder? Helen Keller....?

Still, it IS good to know that he appreciates our campaign, even if (for whatever lawyerese-mumbo-jumbo legal reasons) he cannot make too much of it. He knew that we were behind him then, just as we should be now.

This way he has assured us that the 'Suit-prefered' B5 movie was not going to happen, didn't happen this time, and will not happen in the future. How many people do you know that would not compromise their loyalty to themselves, their belief in their product, or their fans in such a way? You probably know some but I'd bet that the quality is very rare in this world.

And when THE BABYLON 5 movie eventually does come along, it is going to ROCK!