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  • #31
    Re: Re: Can we just leave it alone?

    Originally posted by Tibbetts
    I also thought Crusade should've gone on longer and that Warner Bros should've kept its nose out of the shows direction.
    Just a minor correction here. It was TNT Atlanta that deliberately caused Crusade's demise, not WB.

    Jan
    "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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    • #32
      Re: Re: Re: Can we just leave it alone?

      Originally posted by Jan
      Just a minor correction here. It was TNT Atlanta that deliberately caused Crusade's demise, not WB.

      Jan
      Thought WB and TNT were partners.



      Tibbetts
      Admiral Tibbetts' Sci-Fi Board. <=== First try at creating a board. Feel free to check it out if ya want.

      "I'm a man-
      But I can change-
      If I have to-
      ... I guess." - Man's Prayer

      "only the dead have seen the end of war." - Plato

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      • #33
        Re: Re: Re: Re: Can we just leave it alone?

        Originally posted by Tibbetts
        Thought WB and TNT were partners.



        Tibbetts
        Actually, TNT is a subsidiary of Time-Warner...so is WB Studios and WB Domestic Television. Neither had or has any control over the other. It was TNT Atlanta that caused the demise of CRUSADE...WB Domestic Television was 100% in support of the series and tried to find another venue for it. However, TNT wanted so much money for the rights to CRUSADE that no one would buy it.

        CE
        Anthony Flessas
        Writer/Producer/Director,
        SP Pictures


        I have no avatar! I walk in mystery and need nothing to represent who and what I am!

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        • #34
          Right. With relation to Crusade TNT and WB were network and producing studio. Their corporate relationship did not really have any impact on the series. They were no different in this respect than ABC (network) and Fox (studio) are with regards to NYPD Blue - the network airs the show and has some input during production, the studio owns the show and the ancillary rights. Time Warner is not nearly as integrated an organization as Dinsey/ABC, NBC/Universal, the Fox companies or Paramount/Viacom. Hell, the various Warner Bros. divisions are barely on speaking terms, often work at cross-purposes and sometimes flat-out compete with one another. Their relationship with other T-W entities is even more distant. (At the time of the Crusade mess Warner Bros. was going to sue TNT for payment on the remaining 9 season one episodes - because the network had contracted for a full 22-episode season and was refusing to pay up. The suit was only halted when someone higher up in the T-W food chain realized that ultimately the shareholders would have ended up paying the lawyers on both sides of the suit. And the settlement money would have come out of the parent company's left pocket and gone into its right.)

          Regards,

          Joe
          Joseph DeMartino
          Sigh Corps
          Pat Tallman Division

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          • #35
            There was some good things about season 5. I personally didnt enjoy the telepath arc. The centari arc was good as well. Season five seemed to show more of the b5 universe. Such as the drazi homeworld, some brackari aspect the day of the dead. The day of a psi cop and maintence technican. There was a more mix of episodes in season five almost like season one. For crusade it was kinda of hit or miss for me. I havent decided if i will buy the episdoes or not, i have bought everything else. The legend of the rangers had a good start. I thought the weapons system was stupid. That would have to be changed. Just for a pesonel note i liked season 2 as one of my favortite seasons. I liked the narn centori conflict. I prefer wars between more even enemys. I would like to see a mini series with the digar war. I know it wont happen. Thats my two cents

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            • #36
              Re: Re: Re: Re: Can we just leave it alone?

              Originally posted by Tibbetts
              Thought WB and TNT were partners.
              It would seem the WB corporate philosophy is more one of battling divisions. The divisions seem more adversarial, probably in an effort to show greater profitability than other divisions and thus control more of the overall budget. It has always seemed like WB TV was good to JMS and B5, but TNT killed crusade; WB Home Video refused to put out B5 for the longest time; WB Home Video was responsible for the Crusade commentary edit; and WB Features is mucking about with the movie. Perhaps none of them really want to give credit to the work done by the TV division. *SIGH*
              "That was the law, as set down by Valen. Three castes: worker, religious, warrior."

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              • #37
                I hate this commercial American mantra: "if you had success with something, then make sequels until the public will puke on it". I totally agree with the subject of this topic.

                I mean, I would really like to see good B5 theatrical movie with the original actors and in the B5 universe. But I'm almost sure that either the original characters will be recast or there will be no original characters and under commercial pressure JMS will either rewrite part of existing B5 story or even will dumb it down (to make it easy for casual movie-goer).

                Also I feel, that most of the TNT TV-movies and "Crusade" are mostly cash-ins on existing universe.

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                • #38
                  I could agree that the TV movies for TNT were cash-ins... however for Crusade JMS said early on the B5 development that there was a side story that he might go into, but that there would be no actual sequel nor a Babylon 6.

                  You can find some of those comments at the Lurker's Guide pages for Crusade (and in this JMS archive, of course).

                  I do agree that wringing every last penny from a property and converting it into a commercial franchise is quite despicable an attitude from Hollywood, I also don't want to see that happen to B5.
                  But at this moment in time I am not concerned that it could even happen.

                  Now, if TMoS turns out to be a recasted travesty I'll be concerned, I just hope that doesn't happen.
                  Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
                  James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

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                  • #39
                    My gut tells me this isn't getting out of the starting gate.

                    Of course, that could just be the chilli talking...
                    Beer is the great equalizer.

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Capt.Montoya
                      however for Crusade JMS said early on the B5 development that there was a side story that he might go into, but that there would be no actual sequel nor a Babylon 6.
                      I recently digged through Lurker's and found that initially JMS spoke that there will be no any kind of spin-offs. But during the course of the B5 series he changed the attitude, and started talking about one possible spin-off story.

                      Anyway, "Crusade" died as an infant. Since a lot details of it's real story arc appeared over the years - I think that it could be as great as B5. But never got a chance to prove it.

                      I've just put my orders for "Movie Pack" and "Crusade" back
                      I still want them.

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                      • #41
                        I do not understand why every one is comparing season 5 to the other seasons. My opinion here is that if we did not have season 5 then season four would have been the wrost ending ever for a great series.

                        I believe the season 5 was a great wrap up for all B5 project, alot of loose ends where brought up and "clarifeid" during that season, and also it opened alot of new opportunities for new and future movies.

                        The telepath problem in season 5 was a great starting point for the future Telepath war to come and also for Leta Alexander (Pat. tallman) to leave B5 and wonder away with J'kar.

                        The idea of extra conflicts taking place after the shadows and the vorlons left the galaxy is 100% great and true, since it shows us that the struggle between evil and good is endless and it does n depend on certain people or races. Even the Drazi who were major partners in the alliance ended up to have their own agenda.

                        The destruction of B5 in the last episode was something that should have taken place, because it was predicted by that centuri lady who was reading the future - the one that was saying that the shadows (unknown at the time) are coming for the other centuri lord.

                        It also put a new track for every one of the main characters, Garibuldi, Franklien, Sheridan, Delin, Ivanova.

                        Again season 5 was a greater closure for a great B5 and even if thigns were moving slower, still it is a must have.

                        Regards
                        Last edited by hishamT; 01-26-2005, 03:01 AM.
                        What do you want? ha...!

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by hishamT
                          My opinion here is that if we did not have season 5 then season four would have been the wrost ending ever for a great series.
                          Not exactly,SiL was supposed to be the final episode for Season 4 (it was shot during season 4),but JMS got the call that they will go for season 5,so he had to make a different last episode for S4 and thus gave it The Deconstruction of Falling Stars.

                          IMHO B5 should have ended with season 4 (with SiL as its last episode)...but still,i think season 5 was great on its own.

                          Just a side note:
                          Those who were watching the entire show as it was aired on TV were so used to S3 and S4 action pack story..from episode to episode getting bigger and bigger until the Shadows War exploded and the Battle for Earth was concluded,so when S5 stared it was slow....and kept on being slow (comparing to the previous two seasons).
                          Sleeping in Light-----Darnit! Shut the Window.

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                          • #43
                            Even with SiL as the last episode, I think a lot of things would've been "missing". Too much would've been "left in the dark".
                            And Deconstruction of Falling Stars was an interesting episode on its own, wouldn't want to have missed that one either.

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                            • #44
                              Same here don't get me wrong,i wouldnt want to miss S5 as well,but IMO B5 should have ended with S4 with SiL as its final episode,that would have made it just perfect!!

                              I still love season 5,that doesn't mean in any way that i put S5 in the garbage.
                              Sleeping in Light-----Darnit! Shut the Window.

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                              • #45
                                Now that's contradictory. How can you not want to miss S5 and still want B5 to end with S4? I mean, if B5 ended with S4+SiL, there'd be no S5. Yet you want S5? Make up your mind
                                In my opinion S5 ends B5 better than stopping with S4+SiL ever would have
                                Last edited by tvih; 01-27-2005, 04:04 PM.

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