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Babylon 5, Great Maker, and Religion

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  • Hmmm... Well - it's an interesting question whether those values are "embeded" in some way into our universe.

    One thing that makes human uniqe - is the ability to overcome fillings by doing or not doing something. For example - not to enter the conflict even if you are angry (not every time it works ).

    The values I'm talking about prevent people from going after the pulse, after the filling. This phenomenon is not very natural.

    Maybe it's an education we get at the early stages of our life... But maybe it's something else...

    And by the way - no word can truly convey a value.

    Freedom - is a value. But when you say freedom - one see democracy - the other - anarchy. Do both of them convey the real meaning of freedom?
    Seek salvation, for the war is here... Deny nothing

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    • Originally posted by Spirit
      And by the way - no word can truly convey a value.

      Freedom - is a value. But when you say freedom - one see democracy - the other - anarchy. Do both of them convey the real meaning of freedom?
      Good points. And in a nutshell, that probably explains why there are multiple holy books and why the entire Bible isn't just those 10 commandments. But what other way is there for humans to communicate since telepathy isn't available to us? Throughout history people have been communicating values and illustrating them with parables and sermons and song and other means but in the end it's words being used.

      Seems like there ought to be a better way, huh?

      Jan
      "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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      • Originally posted by Jan

        Seems like there ought to be a better way, huh?

        Jan
        Word is not perfect, but it is better than silence.
        When words are silent - fillings talk - and some times it is better no to hear what they have to say.

        Seek salvation, for the war is here... Deny nothing

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        • Well, for those who like to believe the Bible is the revealed word of God, check out what Jesus had to say about Hypocrites.
          (Replace scribes and Pharisees with Lawyers and Politicians and you see that This passage at least does seem to be universal.

          11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant. Mt. 20.26, 27 À Mk. 9.35 ; 10.43, 44 À Lk. 22.26
          12 And whosoever shall exalt himself shall be abased; and he that shall humble himself shall be exalted. Lk. 14.11 ; 18.14
          13 Â But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
          14 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretense make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
          15 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
          16 Â Woe unto you, ye blind guides, which say, Whosoever shall swear by the temple, it is nothing; but whosoever shall swear by the gold of the temple, he is a debtor!
          17 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gold, or the temple that sanctifieth the gold?
          18 And, Whosoever shall swear by the altar, it is nothing; but whosoever sweareth by the gift that is upon it, he is guilty.
          19 Ye fools and blind: for whether is greater, the gift, or the altar that sanctifieth the gift?
          20 Whoso therefore shall swear by the altar, sweareth by it, and by all things thereon.
          21 And whoso shall swear by the temple, sweareth by it, and by him that dwelleth therein.
          22 And he that shall swear by heaven, sweareth by the throne of God, Is. 66.1 À Mt. 5.34 and by him that sitteth thereon.
          23 Â Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, Lev. 27.30 and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.
          24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.
          25 Â Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
          26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
          27 Â Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, Acts 23.3 which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
          28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
          29 Â Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
          30 and say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
          31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
          32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
          33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, Mt. 3.7 ; 12.34 À Lk. 3.7 how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
          34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
          35 that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel Gen. 4.8 unto the blood of Zechari'ah 2 Chr. 24.20, 21 son of Berechi'ah, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
          36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

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          • Amusing quote

            This is a quote from Pakuda's (an 11th century Jewish philosopher) Duties of the Heart. The context of passage was that he was trying to explain the many different people who read the Bible.

            "People who are able to read the texts and stories of the Scriptures and are satisfied with the literal sense, ignoring their deeper meaning and the precise explanation of the words and the use of language. These people are equal in stature to a donkey carrying books."

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            • Well, he has a point

              It's almost like to read a fable for its story line....
              Seek salvation, for the war is here... Deny nothing

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