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**AmyG** · 08-25-2004, 10:42 AM

You're trying to buy part of an item that isn't sold that way, just because they came out with something better since you bought it, and when they won't sell the thing that isn't available separately to you you're angry?

I think it was about eleven days after I bought my next-to-last Mac that Apple started shipping that model with a better combo drive. For the same price I paid for the lesser drive. Yeah, I was pretty annoyed, but that's the way the cookie crumbles. You pays your money, you takes your chances.

As for the change in packaging, and your requirement that they should have told you that a change was coming: how can you blame a company for wanting to sell stock that they've already manufactured?

Why not just buy another set if you're that concerned about the packaging? Me, I care about the story. I probably wouldn't have cared if the DVDs had come in a plain brown cardboard box.

Aisling

**Jump Now** · 08-25-2004, 11:13 AM

Okay, I agree with you that the story comes first. And I was quite prepared to have 2 seasons packaged one way, and 3 packaged another way, as long as I have the episodes. It's just a little annoying that they couldn't have settled on the packaging before they started - the original boxes are almost falling apart when they come through your door.

Okay, *as I said*, it's a petty complaint. I was - and am - more irritated about the manner in which they deal with customers. And it's surely a valid question, asking if I can perhaps *buy* newer packaging? They don't have spares anywhere, in case of damages?

No, I'm not that angry. No, it doesn't matter too much. And I don't blame a company for wanting to sell products they've already manufactured - I've already bought it. Not being rich, I was just looking at another way of housing the discs in something a bit more durable. And this is the latest in a long line of - yes, not too important in the scheme of things - "problems" with these discs, all of which add a little bit more to the irritation factor.

Please don't be condescending and suggest that because I've addressed a few issues regarding the packaging, I care very little about the content.

**AmyG** · 08-25-2004, 11:29 AM

the original boxes are almost falling apart when they come through your door.

Wow, that sounds pretty bad. I didn't realize it was as desperate as this. What kind of packaging did you get for those first two sets in the UK? Here in the US, we have a slipcase, and inside that a book-style folio. All of my slipcases and folios are in pretty good shape after much use.

I'm sorry to have implied that you don't care about the content - that wasn't my intent. It's just that I hear _so_ much on the various newsgroups and message boards about CGI issues, and packaging issues, that it seems sometimes that the idea of what a brilliant _story_ this was gets lost.

Have you tried writing to Warner Bros. rather than calling? When you call, you often get people who are working with limited resources - they have a limited number of ways to solve problems, and no one to whom to refer you. With a letter, if the first low-rung person doesn't know what to do with you, they might elevate the issue to a higher-level customer satisfaction professional. What I'm saying is that if you _really_ want that new packaging, you might do better by putting your complaint in writing, and sending it by post (rather than phone or e-mail).

Good luck with it - and if you _do_ manage to squeeze some new packaging out of them, please let us know!

Aisling

**Dr Maturin** · 08-25-2004, 12:10 PM

I work in quality assurance for the world's largest protein producer and let me tell you what we do with write-in letters. We read them, determine the legitimacy, the importance and the significance. About 65% are tossed due to them being hoaxes (we got one last month from a woman claiming a bone broke her tooth and she was up for a toothpaste commercial and a spot on the Dallas Cowboys Cheerleaders) 20% are considered ridiculous and tossed and the other 15% are legit and we send coupons and an apology.

Yours, from the sound of it, is NOT legit. The packaging falling apart sounds shady. You should contact the vendor about something like that.

**Dr Maturin** · 08-25-2004, 12:14 PM

Cool user name, btw...

**WRTWORTHY** · 08-25-2004, 12:37 PM

Ok, im back, and JUMP NOW, right on, I am totaly agreement with you on this topic, however people on this board dont care about us Fans in the EU and keep telling us to shut up and be thankful we even have a series, nothing to do with the fact thay have all proper DVD case's. speical feture's and had season 5 8 months before us, but oohhh no, they dont care that WB has ruined B5 for Most EU fans due to their rubbish marketing, mate we are screwed ove, big time, what can we do? I mean I tried getting the B5 customer covers and cant get the boxs, i cant do anything, my collection is falling apart and there is nothing i can do

thanks a goddame lot WB!!

**Doktor** · 08-25-2004, 01:06 PM

WRTWORTHY, stop whining for gawds sake! I live in the UK. I'm far from happy regarding the box sets. But there's no point blabbing on about it in the forums from now until the end of time. The packaging sucks, but it's not the end of the world. Get over it.

Jump Now.... with you all the way. You're approach was sensible. Sorry you didn't get a result, but not surprised.

The analogy to being annoyed when a superior product is released does not hold good. Buyers of DVD box sets are collectors, and anal though it may be, many of us like to have matching sets. The first three series were releases sequentially as part of a set, and then the distributor effectively stopped that release before it was finished, and then released another product.

**Capt.Montoya** · 08-25-2004, 01:21 PM

Originally posted by WRTWORTHY
Ok, im back, and JUMP NOW, right on, I am totaly agreement with you on this topic, however people on this board dont care about us Fans in the EU and keep telling us to shut up and be thankful we even have a series, nothing to do with the fact thay have all proper DVD case's. speical feture's and had season 5 8 months before us, but oohhh no, they dont care that WB has ruined B5 for Most EU fans due to their rubbish marketing, mate we are screwed ove, big time, what can we do? I mean I tried getting the B5 customer covers and cant get the boxs, i cant do anything, my collection is falling apart and there is nothing i can do

thanks a goddame lot WB!!

Is not that we don't care... at least I cared, but you in particular seem to come on the boards only to complain and vent, and place blame on JMS for things beyond his control. It gets tiring.
Your posting style doesn't help me to empathize with you, wrtworthy. Sorry.

----

I get the impression that the new packaging in the UK is better... have you considered that the change may have been a result of fan outrage?
(Just speculating, ignore if you wish)

I agree that a letter may get a better answer, BTW.

Best wishes in getting a more pleasing product and release schedule to all the European Union fans of B5.

**Dr Maturin** · 08-25-2004, 02:48 PM

<<I get the impression that the new packaging in the UK is better... have you considered that the change may have been a result of fan outrage?
(Just speculating, ignore if you wish)>>

Ha! The irony.

**Jump Now** · 08-25-2004, 03:33 PM

Aisling: An apology. There was no need for me to be so snappy in my reply, and I'm sorry. It's seeing Sinclair almost twice as wide which has me wearing my bad head, I swear!

The original packaging for the first 3 sets is - as far as I'm aware - exactly the same as your US releases of the boxsets. Maybe mine had just been treated rougher before arriving with me - and I should have complained at the time, but thought I'd be getting pretty much the same for the other 4 seasons. As Doktor says, they effectively changed their mind about the packaging after season 3 - probably *due* to complaints, as he suggests. Hugely ironic, yes.

The weird thing, I suppose, is that none of us would be bothered if they'd stuck with that all the way through. And again, probably not too concerned if they'd stuck with just changing 4 & 5. It's the going back - and re-vamping - which has made some of us think "we want them all the same". Yeah it's anal (most people are about *something*), but those of us who are readily accept it. I guess it's that we don't see the problems that have accompanied the B5 releases happening very much elsewhere - and it's our favourite show!

Yeah, to be perfectly honest, I'm sick of hearing *myself* whinge about packaging and different releases for different regions etc. The thought did cross my mind, as I was writing my original post, that I've contributed nothing to any B5 forum except complaints. So just for the record: I've never seen a better show than B5 - Doctor Who is still hanging around in the background ready for a fight, though - and as soon as I think of something interesting to say about it, I'll post. No one hold their breath.

I work in customer services, ZHD (god alone knows why), so I know what you mean. People really do try it on sometimes.

And I know how annoying it can be, Wrtworthy. There is a lack of care and attention on the part of WB, it has to be said. A lot of mistakes and bad choices have been made. But really - it's nothing to do with JMS. That man has fought for us all the way.

**Andrew_Swallow** · 08-25-2004, 08:25 PM

The fate and privilege of Science Fiction is to ôBoldly go where no man has gone beforeö. Consequently SF people find the hidden chasms by walking over them, in our red shirts. After climbing out it is our duty to report back and warn of the existence of the problem. If we are feeling kind we may even suggest that a bridge be built over the chasm.

Each of the Babylon 5 boxes has produced complaints. If you look carefully the DVD holders they are different in each season, as Warner Brothers UK made various attempts to prevent the DVDs from being scratched. By Season 4 in the UK they solved the problem by getting rid of the holders. Boxes that damage the product are definitely not fit for their purpose.

In the case (sic) of requests for new cases for the first 3 seasons this is not a complaint, it is a request for a new product. Consequently it has to be sent to the people in charge of new products. Writing to the complaints department, with a polite request that the letter be sent up the hierarchy, may be the only way for an outsider to reach these people. Since developing new boxes will cost several thousand pounds the person is likely to be a board member. The company would only produce a special if a lot of people ask for it.

**Doktor** · 08-26-2004, 12:34 AM

Each of the Babylon 5 boxes has produced complaints. If you look carefully the DVD holders they are different in each season, as Warner Brothers UK made various attempts to prevent the DVDs from being scratched. By Season 4 in the UK they solved the problem by getting rid of the holders. Boxes that damage the product are definitely not fit for their purpose.

This reminds me..... another point worth making is that it's not the fact that they've changed the interior of the boxes that's the problem. If they'd changed the packaging whilst at least taking care to ensure that the artwork on the spines matched up then I certainly wouldn't have had a problem.

**cornholio1980** · 08-26-2004, 02:29 AM

Actually, the holders of the S1 and S2-boxes were the same (and if I'm not mistaken, the same as with the R1-Release). Already then they had problems with DVD falling out of the packaging, but because the holders were rather soft, the DVD's didn't get scratches. Now, someone from Warner decided that they should take a different approach on S3, with much stronger holders so that the DVD's cannot fall out. But I guess something didn't work when the DVD's were packaged, because now almost EVERYONE had 1 or more loose DVDs, and because of the stronger holders, those were usually scratched beyond being playable. The following exchange did cost Warner quite a bunch, I guess, so they decided to go for a new packaging.

Now, I DEFINITELY don't like it, especially because I just LOVED the old fold-out boxes (I think they look REALLY stylish), but I can understand why Warner did what they did.

And everyone that doesn't like the change in packaging has the possibility to get other cases and use those great covers , which are much better than the original ones anyway...

FAITH MANAGES
cornholio1980

**cornholio1980** · 09-15-2004, 02:55 AM

I'm not sure if this message really fits in here, but I don't really want to start a new thread just because of it.

There seems to be a new release date for europe for the Season 5-Box: 17th January 2005!!

play.com

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