A Fresh Look

[Compound Fracture]

Hi. I have read here for years. I might have even registered once a long time ago and made a post - don't remember either way.

My wife and I started watching B5 from the first episode when it originally aired. We never missed a minute of the show all the way through to the end on TNT in 1998.

With that background out of the way, my wife and I broke out the B5 DVD collection a few weeks ago and started with episode 1, season 1. I hadn't seen any episodes since it was in reruns on...well...don't remember that either.

Anyhow...

We are really enjoying the journey. It still seems fresh - some 18 years later. Man, that is hard to fathom. 18 years. I wanted to put up some initial impressions now that we're about through with season 1. If I get any discussion, I guess I'll keep coming back and adding to this thread as we progress through the seasons. If no reaction or discussion, no problem.

Here we go - bulletized - and in no particular order.

*I'm impressed with Sinclair. I'd forgotten what a good actor Michael O'Hare was/is. Why can't we have real leaders like he plays it as commander of B5? Wise, humble, diplomatic, caring, truth-telling. Where are those people?

*The writing. It is so good to visit the mind of JMS again as written into the B5 universe. I'm always struck by the emotion he writes into characters, as well as the way everything always seems to be, ultimately, a chase for the truth. It's just good to visit again. I don't know how else to put it.

*Of course the CGI is dated, but it still works for me. At times, at least here in season 1, it seems better than others, but overall, for the time it was done - it still works for me. But I'm a fan and biased.

*The sets are rich and detailed. John Copeland and Doug Netter, if memory serves, are most responsible for that, and they sure earned their pay. I bet they had a small budget with which to work, but I really have no idea.

*Claudia Christian and Andrea Thompson sure are easy on the eyes. Andrea, in particular, and this is entirely my own take, during her run on B5 just has this sort of classic, old-Hollywood, screen-siren sort of look going on. To me, she just sets the screen to smoldering. I think it is her voice too. Claudia, of course, is beautiful, and her acting chops are polished. I don't remember all the Russian references from the first time I watched, but she has made several in this first season. Not complaining - just giving my impressions. It's all good. I did remember she was Russian and the story about her father and mother, I just didn't remember her referring to her Russian roots so often.

*The music. Now I remember why I bought all those discs from Sonic Images back in the day. Time to break them out.

Those are pretty long bullets. Hope you don't mind. I have more to say, but it is late. We still have the last 3 eps of season 1 to get through, so I'll be back with more. I'm going to ask my wife what her impressions are too.

Thanks for reading.

[babylonlurker]

Welcome, C_F, I am sure you will get a response.

One thing I noticed when I watched just the first episode (for the nth time) - "Midnight on the Firing Line" was the amount of foreshadowing.

Already in that episode we get some good hints of what is coming. The First season title "Signs and Portends" is exactly what we get in that season.

OK, the departure of Michael O'Hare does break a bit of that, but on the whole I really like the first season.

[Compound Fracture]

Thanks for the welcome B-Lurker. And yes, I do go by CF at the one other message board I frequent, and I prefer that moniker. You picked up on it right away!

Your remark on the foreshadowing echoes what my wife said when I asked her for her impressions this morning (as promised late last night). She also said she has been struck by the amount of social issues people are still dealing with in the B5 universe. She likes that it's not such a perfect and sanitized world back on earth, or at B5. We've had a strike, political strife, attempts at vengeance (the guy that thought he was cheated out of command of B5 - can't remember his character's name), poverty (the lurkers), etc.

In the Trek universe, social problems seem to be solved. I know for a fact I heard it said on Next Gen that they had no poverty, and that humans no longer used money.

Another observation from me. Once again, I'm struck by the kindness and respect given to religion. Many years ago, while the series was still running, I sent JMS an e-mail. To my surprise, JMS replied to my e-mail. Moron that I can be, I did not preserve that e-mail - though a copy may be in my paper files somewhere. One of the subjects I covered in that mail was the respect he gave to religion. He's not a religious man - if memory serves - and he could do the Trek thing and ignore it while giving it only passing reference as to how we have evolved out of it, but JMS chose to not only include it, but he made religion a major part of the universe. His response to the religion remarks I made were something along the lines that he was sure it would always be with us and that he felt it was necessary to be included in any universe populated with humans.

[babylonlurker]

Thanks for the welcome B-Lurker. And yes, I do go by CF at the one other message board I frequent, and I prefer that moniker. You picked up on it right away!
...
In the Trek universe, social problems seem to be solved. I know for a fact I heard it said on Next Gen that they had no poverty, and that humans no longer used money.

Another observation from me. Once again, I'm struck by the kindness and respect given to religion. Many years ago, while the series was still running, I sent JMS an e-mail. To my surprise, JMS replied to my e-mail. Moron that I can be, I did not preserve that e-mail - though a copy may be in my paper files somewhere. One of the subjects I covered in that mail was the respect he gave to religion. He's not a religious man - if memory serves - and he could do the Trek thing and ignore it while giving it only passing reference as to how we have evolved out of it, but JMS chose to not only include it, but he made religion a major part of the universe. His response to the religion remarks I made were something along the lines that he was sure it would always be with us and that he felt it was necessary to be included in any universe populated with humans.

Yes, I was struck by JMS' treatment of religion as well. He claims to be an atheist, though from the script books I know he has been involved in religion at an early time of his life. That may have given him the perspective we see all through the series. One thing is sure, he has a *very* good grasp of mythology, so that is probably where he picks up the spiritual aspects of B5.

One of my favourite non arc episodes is "Passing Through Gethsemane", it is probably the best treatment of religious/mythological issues I have seen in any science fiction. In my years I have seen a fair amount of SF.

As an aside, I am re-watching the series "Taken" from 2003. I still like what I see in that one, and may write up a review on my blog.

[Jonas]

In the Trek universe, social problems seem to be solved. I know for a fact I heard it said on Next Gen that they had no poverty, and that humans no longer used money.

Star Trek functions in a very different way from Babylon 5. Star Trek (as conceived by Gene Roddenberry) is critical of the present by showing us a future that we could someday achieve; Babylon 5 shows us a possible future that strongly reflects the present.

[Compound Fracture]

One of my favourite non arc episodes is "Passing Through Gethsemane", it is probably the best treatment of religious/mythological issues I have seen in any science fiction. In my years I have seen a fair amount of SF.

As an aside, I am re-watching the series "Taken" from 2003. I still like what I see in that one, and may write up a review on my blog.

Totally agree - love Passing Through Gethsemane. I'm not familiar with Taken. Though I recognize the name for some reason.

[Compound Fracture]

Star Trek functions in a very different way from Babylon 5. Star Trek (as conceived by Gene Roddenberry) is critical of the present by showing us a future that we could someday achieve; Babylon 5 shows us a possible future that strongly reflects the present.

No disagreement there. I recognize that, and I'm not trying to imply one view is better than the other - only that I (and my wife) like what we see on B5.

[David Panzer]

It's always neat to read about people discovering B5 for the first time, or in the case of Compound Fracture (like the same BTW) rediscovering it years later. I'm in the latter.

One thing that helped in my rediscovering of B5 is my love for retro video games. Be it replaying the games I loved growing up and trying to beat them for the umpteenth time or discovering past gems that for whatever reason I didn't play. The gameplay and the story (depending on the game and it's respective genre) is what draws me in instead of the graphics.

How this relates to B5 is that it was the story that kept me hooked on B5 and had me impatiently awaiting the release date of the next season on DVD. If I was one that was to borrow a term from gaming circles a "graphics-whore", I wouldn't have stuck with the show.

One thing I've noticed is that while some people can't get past the CGI on B5 (no one on this site at all), those same individuals have no problem watching an old movie. Kinda funny.

[Compound Fracture]

Hi Willie. I was completely addicted to B5 when it ran on PTEN/TNT back in the 1990s. Several years back, my wife bought me all five seasons on DVD. Over the years, I had watched a few favorite episodes and some of the special features on the DVDs, but I had not watched the series all the way through since it ran on TV. In fact, the first season, until a few weeks ago when we started watching, was still in the cellophane wrapper.

Today we watched Babylon Squared, and The Quality of Mercy.

No new revelations. I'm still just enjoying being wrapped in Straczynski's wit, wisdom, sense of truth, and the B5 universe.

I once had a conversation with a guy that made fun of B5's CGI. I was disappointed, angry and actually kind of hurt by his comments. I was "all in" for the show, and to me, to this day, B5 is still the best show ever put on TV. To hear someone disparage the show, and what was then groundbreaking use of computers to make special effects shots, was hard to take.

[Marsden]

Great thread. I've had this kind of idea but hadn't really carried through with it. It's great that your wife watches with you and you can discuss things over with her, that's a great thing.

I never minded the CGI, I still rewatch Star Trek with the visible wires holding up the shuttlecraft and Land of the Lost (from the 70s only) with the puppet dinosaurs and it doesn't bother me a bit if it's a good story and they did their best with what they had. Really, the only time I think one might have a good complaint about CGI when it is the story, like those Anaconda movies or SyFy crap fest of the week.

[I, Zathras]

Welcome Compound Fracture, sure you'll get plenty of replies.

I, like you, recently started re-watching the show and my mam wanted to watch it too as she loves Bruce B! I also found Sinclair to be a great character after initially not remembering him too fondly. I think that's because BB covered a lot of ranges when he first arrived on the station. Now though, I really appreciate the thoughful approach Michael O'Hare took and think he, as a main character, helped drive the first season and set up the following years. I'm up to season 4, The Hour of the Wolf, and its still engrossing. Damian London and Worthem Crimmer are just exceptional!

WillieStealAndHow - I rediscovered my old consoles and bought a NES, SNES and Megadrive (already had an Amiga 1200) and I love those old games, there's just something about them. I might start a thread about old games as there's so many to talk about (I just found that I have R-Type, result).

Also, the point about old films and FX. I love Harryhausen movies and whilst the special effects aren't as good as T2 (which I watched last night and is a bit of a stretch for a comparison, I know!) but Marsden, you're right, its the story which carries the movie. The effects are there to add to the experience, or at least they should be, they shouldn't be the driving force behind a film. Its the same with B5: The fx are there to compliment the show, its the story and the characters which are the main driver. That's not to say I'm not biased about B5's effects being fantastic, I am, the shot of the station lighting up in the shadow of Epsilon 3 is still one of my favourites on TV. It just looks, well, cool!

[Compound Fracture]

That's not to say I'm not biased about B5's effects being fantastic, I am, the shot of the station lighting up in the shadow of Epsilon 3 is still one of my favourites on TV. It just looks, well, cool!

So agree! Totally. There is some ground breaking CGI within the show. I don't take kindly to the work being disparaged. I've only ever really had that one person say something about it to me personally, but I do recall reading a review back when the show was running that wasn't very kind.

Clue to the lurking disparagers: It was a TV show, not a full-length, big-budget film with millions of dollars to spend on effects.

Anyhow, thank you for the welcome. Very much appreciated! You're all the way up to season IV, eh. I love all the seasons, and now, like you, I have a much better appreciation for season I. Specifically, Sinclair.

Another observation. I don't remember Corwin showing up so early. He showed up about half way through the first season. His hair was much longer. As we near the end of the season, his hair is growing shorter. At some point he goes military and cuts it very short - which is how I remember him.

So, we have Chrysalis left. We'll probably watch it today. Just by way of explanation: We have two sons. Last November, on the same weekend, one got married and the other left for the U.S. Army. We went from being full-time parents to not having any real parenting duties - over night. I won't lie, or try to gloss it over - it was a wrenching experience. Our B5 watching is helping us get past the emotions of the "empty-nest" syndrome.

Marsden. Thank you for the welcome! If you read the paragraph above, you now know a little more about why it is great to have my wife watch with me. She watched it with me when it was in first run. But she too is gaining a new appreciation for the show. Our emotions are still somewhat raw, so I think she's really taking the excellent writing to heart. There are some things bigger than us, and we can't control everything - all we can do is manage. The great writing and themes found within B5 will help us put things back into perspective while we pass the time and adjust. Yes, I truly believe those last few sentences I wrote. For time is the great healer. Edit add: For time is the great healer, and B5 is STILL the BEST show ever put on TV.

[Jonas]

People complaining about the CGI drive me nuts. It's like they're incapable of seeing beyond some basic technical aspects to the design and style and composition, which no series has yet surpassed, and which will always remain excellent.

Frankly, I think people's complaints about CGI (anywhere) are mostly the result of conditioning; they're just repeating a meme. I regularly hear people complain about how The Lord of the Rings looks so much better than the new Star Wars movies because they used miniatures. But frankly, pretty much the same methods were used in both movies (a combination of miniatures and CGI), and no matter what you think of these movies, the visuals in Star Wars are considerably more smooth and better-integrated. The real difference is that Peter Jackson's PR put a huge emphasis on the use of "bigatures" (sigh).

The same goes for so many movies I've seen in the cinema lately. If the critics said "too much CGI" then everyone parrots it, even if it's completely absurd. And if the critics say "the CGI is impressive!" then everyone says that, even though that usually means that the CGI was done in MS Paint by a myopic dog.

[Compound Fracture]

And if the critics say "the CGI is impressive!" then everyone says that, even though that usually means that the CGI was done in MS Paint by a myopic dog.

As to the rest of your post; truth well said.

[Commander Raiden]

I'm also one of those one's who's rediscovered B5 Lately after 14-15 years, back in Nov/Dec of last year I was watching all the episodes and TV movies released so far, still haven't got round to seeing Crusades as yet, On another note anyone know what happend to that site, by the "Madgoner" (I think I got the name right) which detailed all the b5 concept art, of the ships, why they were designed, how they were designed etc, it was a great site, but never got a chance to fully explore it!