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  • #16
    Originally posted by Jan
    You mean like, "This isn't some deep space franchise, this station is *about* something!"? There All Honor Lies by Peter David.

    Jan
    Ah...yes! That's the one!
    Anthony Flessas
    Writer/Producer/Director,
    SP Pictures


    I have no avatar! I walk in mystery and need nothing to represent who and what I am!

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    • #17
      <<Actually, there are several slams on B&B's era of Trek...but for some reason...I'm drawing a complete blank at the moment>>

      DS9 was NOT B&B Trek. It was B&P originally, though by the time Ivanova said that, it was out of B&P's hands for the most part. I am not sure, but I will have to research it when I get home from work.
      Recently, there was a reckoning. It occurred on November 4, 2014 across the United States. Voters, recognizing the failures of the current leadership and fearing their unchecked abuses of power, elected another party as the new majority. This is a first step toward preventing more damage and undoing some of the damage already done. Hopefully, this is as much as will be required.

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      • #18
        "This isn't some deep space franchise, this station is *about* something!"?
        That's not about a particular piece of Trek.

        It's about the whole trek "Franchise" concept as practiced by Paramont.

        Not just the Shows. The relentless and endless merchandising where Paramont perfoms a walletectomy on every fan in sight.

        Not that I don't want a Few "goodies".

        But after "Director's Cut V33.99.9999" comes out, I start beginning to feel a little bit "Used & Abused".
        Last edited by bakana; 07-21-2004, 06:20 PM.

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        • #19
          Was there ever any dig to Star Wars on that vein?
          In franchising and merchandising terms they behave the same as Trek...

          Does anyone remember any reference/nod to Star Wars? (I don't.)
          Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
          James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

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          • #20
            <<Does anyone remember any reference/nod to Star Wars? (I don't.)>>

            Aside from my earlier post in this thread and a few other things that can be relegated to mythical influences, I don't believe so, Monty.

            But...doesn't someone say "I have a bad feeling about this," possibly in the fifth season?
            Recently, there was a reckoning. It occurred on November 4, 2014 across the United States. Voters, recognizing the failures of the current leadership and fearing their unchecked abuses of power, elected another party as the new majority. This is a first step toward preventing more damage and undoing some of the damage already done. Hopefully, this is as much as will be required.

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            • #21
              he Harlan Ellison book is even funnier than you might think: The book title was "The Last Dangerous Visions".
              Take a closer look. The book is actually a mock-up of the autobiography that Ellison has always sworn he'll never write.

              Regards,

              Joe
              Joseph DeMartino
              Sigh Corps
              Pat Tallman Division

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              • #22
                <<That's not about a particular piece of Trek.

                It's about the whole trek "Franchise" concept as practiced by Paramont.

                Not just the Shows. The relentless and endless merchandising>>

                Do you glean this from simple deductive reasoning, or is there something solid. We know JMS was sore about DS9, as he'd pitched B5 as a show set in the Trek universe, but then again, he didn't write that line. Peter David, a longtime Trek contributor, did.

                Secondly, and ironically, There All the Honor Lies aired just two days after one of DS9's greatest episodes, Improbable Cause, which set up future storylines and further cemented that the show, unlike its predecessors, was "about something." Also around this time, Piller stepped down to go do Legend ana Ira Behr took over as EP along with Berman, who essentially had nothing to do with DS9 aside from his name in the credits.
                Recently, there was a reckoning. It occurred on November 4, 2014 across the United States. Voters, recognizing the failures of the current leadership and fearing their unchecked abuses of power, elected another party as the new majority. This is a first step toward preventing more damage and undoing some of the damage already done. Hopefully, this is as much as will be required.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by Capt.Montoya

                  Does anyone remember any reference/nod to Star Wars? (I don't.)
                  Well, I'm not entirely sure where the info comes from but on the B5tech.com site they state :

                  During Sheridan's final attack to liberate Earth, forces from his Coalition attacked and disabled the Skywalker midrange bases in the Sol asteroid field, Mars, Jupiter, and labs orbiting Saturn and Uranus. The docks where the Warlocks were being constructed were captured neither they or the new starships were destroyed.
                  My favourite little homage was in grey 17 is missing, when we first see Robert England at the podium making a speech. He raises his hand and waggles his fingers (ala Freddy Kruger)

                  Brought a smile to my face.
                  *Den-Sha*

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                  • #24
                    Hi, this is my first time here. So if I step on any toes, please let me know. That way I won't do it again.

                    Earlier, Captain Montoya wrote:

                    "Does anyone remember any reference/nod to Star Wars? (I don't.)"

                    Now I don't know if this was a nod towards Star Wars, or if the design is one that would be theoretically possible in space, but I've allways been under the impression that the Star Furies were a tribute to the Star Wars X Wings.

                    If I'm wrong, I understand. While I've watched Babylon 5 a couple of times, I don't understand a lot of the goings-on behind the scenes, and if this has allready been brought up, I apologize. But if it hasn't, then I thought I'd go ahead and state what I thought.

                    Anyway, hope I'm not stepping on anyone's toes here You'll probably here from me again soon.

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                    • #25
                      Don't worry, I think most people are toe-less here...
                      Jump in any thread.
                      Welcome, jamielynn.

                      I had forgotten that reference to the Skywalker bases, maybe because I didn't see it in any episode.

                      What was the title of that fictitious autobiography of Harlan Ellison? I thought "Last Dangerous Visions" was an actual anthology edited by him.
                      Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
                      James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

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                      • #26
                        As far as I know, "Last Dangerous Visions" has never been Published. As I posted earlier, Harlan solicted stories for the book, got them and Paid the authors for them (even paid for Extensions because standard Anthology contracts expire if the book doesn't get printed on schedule) But no copies were ever printed and/or offered for Sale to the public.

                        I never heard that the Star Furies were influenced by the X-Wings. A different piece of Trivia about them, though.

                        NASA Engineers praised the design and pronounced it the most Workable design for an orbital construction vehicle they'd ever seen.

                        BTW, did you know that's what the Star Furies really are? Orbital Bulldozers. Construction equipment. That's why they were able to do things like grab an out of control ship and bring it under control. Or tow a disabled ship around.

                        The weapons were a strap on package. Recognizing the truth that any ship truly built to be useful in close quarters orbital heavy construction would be an extremely manouverable and very Fast fighter craft when the engines designed for moving heavy loads were moving only the Star Fury itself.

                        Some of the NASA engineers liked the design so Much, infact, they tried to form a private corporation to try to raise money to actually Design & Build them for sale to the Space Station program.

                        They had the bad luck to get "Used" by the people at Big Bang con as part of the fraudulent sale of unauthorized B5 merchandise. The whole project seemed to fall apart after that.

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                        • #27
                          jamielynn wrote:

                          Now I don't know if this was a nod towards Star Wars, or if the design is one that would be theoretically possible in space, but I've allways been under the impression that the Star Furies were a tribute to the Star Wars X Wings.
                          welcome to the forum.

                          they have a similar X look to them but i think that is where the similarity ends.

                          when the B5 Magazine was being published a few years ago we got to see some of the early Starfury concept art.

                          they had the X cross-section but were totally different from any Star Wars ship, they looked like a Starfury after several courses of steriods, really chunky and heavily built.



                          Bakuna wrote:

                          The weapons were a strap on package. Recognizing the truth that any ship truly built to be useful in close quarters orbital heavy construction would be an extremely manouverable and very Fast fighter craft when the engines designed for moving heavy loads were moving only the Star Fury itself.
                          and your surce for this info?

                          it`s not something i have come across before now.
                          "The trouble with being a cynic is that you eventually get labelled as a highly reliable fortune-teller"

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by bakana
                            BTW, did you know that's what the Star Furies really are? Orbital Bulldozers. Construction equipment. That's why they were able to do things like grab an out of control ship and bring it under control. Or tow a disabled ship around.

                            The weapons were a strap on package. Recognizing the truth that any ship truly built to be useful in close quarters orbital heavy construction would be an extremely manouverable and very Fast fighter craft when the engines designed for moving heavy loads were moving only the Star Fury itself.
                            Not only did I not "know" this I don't believe it without evidence from somebody in the know. The requirements for engines on a space tug and a fighter are completely different. You DO know that tugboats, for instance, have enormously powerful engines but don't double as PT boats when they are unencumbered by a load? Fighter/PT boat engines are designed to operate at high speeds for short lengths of time. They sacrifice engine life for the ability to accelerate quickly. Tugboat engines are longer-lasting though just as powerful because they don't need quick acceleration and so don't have it.

                            If the B5techman.com site states what you have stated it is just another example of them making stuff up, I think. We never see a Starfury used as a tug and never see it even implied that the weapons are just "strap on." Starfuries have grapples because space is a dangerous place and a small investment in a slight ability to aid a fellow craft in distress seems logical.
                            I believe that when we leave a place, part of it goes with us and part of us remains. Go anywhere in the station, when it is quiet, and just listen. After a while, you will hear the echoes of all our conversations, every thought and word we've exchanged. Long after we are gone .. our voices will linger in these walls for as long as this place remains. But I will admit .. that the part of me that is going .. will very much miss the part of you that is staying.

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                            • #29
                              Originally posted by jal
                              they have a similar X look to them but i think that is where the similarity ends.
                              [snip]
                              they had the X cross-section but were totally different from any Star Wars ship, they looked like a Starfury after several courses of steriods, really chunky and heavily built.
                              To take this just a step further, the reason for the "X" was even different. On the X-Wing , the goal seemed to be spreading out the weapons with the wings in the closed position acting as air foils. Note that the engines are close to the body. In the case of the Star Fury, the point was to move the thrusters further off the center of the vehicle to create a more maneuverable vehicle. When the B5 CGI crew created an atmosphere capable version, the Thunderbolt, they actually moved closer to the X-Wing design since the "X" could be extended beyond the thrusters to act as air foils, but the core of the "X" with regard to engines was still more spread out than the X-Wing fighter.
                              "That was the law, as set down by Valen. Three castes: worker, religious, warrior."

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                              • #30
                                we do see a construction/repair version on the show, we get even better shots of it in "Thirdspace".

                                maybe whoever wrote the source material was a bit confused.

                                the Starfury is a good attempt at a "real" space fighter, but it is let down by having such large engines at the ends of it`s wings.

                                i`m not too hot on the physics (feel free to correct me), the more mass an object has at the centre the quicker it can rotate on it`s axis, just watch an ice skater spin, when they do a spin it is slow when their arms are outstreched and they spin really fast when their arms are closer to their body.

                                a more ideal design is to have the heavy engines/power systems closer to the centre and only have directional thrusters at the edges of the wings.

                                either way.... I WANT ONE FOR XMAS!!!
                                "The trouble with being a cynic is that you eventually get labelled as a highly reliable fortune-teller"

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