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Drakh vs. Interstellar Alliance: tech advantage?

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  • #16
    Originally posted by Z'ha'dumDweller
    If Minbar is the center of ISA operations, then maybe the Minbari become one of the shepherd races, not the humans. Or...BOTH. Maybe the An'Shalok become the shepherds and not one race.
    Maybe the Minbari can shepherd the lawful ("unchaotic") ones and Humans the chaotic ones?

    /IamS
    Interstellar Alliance - Sweden's largest Babylon 5-club
    http://www.babcon.org/

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    • #17
      Originally posted by jal
      maybe the smart ones are still out there.... waiting, what`s a wait of a thousand years against the chance of shaping the future? it never bothered the Shadows.
      You didn't know them when they were young...

      Maybe they were like the Drakh, or Humans, or Drazi, or...

      /IamS
      Interstellar Alliance - Sweden's largest Babylon 5-club
      http://www.babcon.org/

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      • #18
        I'm joining a little late, but back to the original question, I'm in agreement with a lot of the thoughts expressed. I think ultimately, the Drakh had a definite tech advantage, but numbers dealt them a losing hand. Not only numbers in terms of population, but numbers in terms of the goodies left behind by the Shadows. I always got the impression that the Shadows were better at sharing tools than technology. The difference in my mind is that the Drakh had these tools they knew how to use, but the couldn't build new ones. If you can't replace items, then the availability will continue to decrease. How much could they carry away, or how many larger items had the Shadows hidden on other worlds? All that makes for a weak strategic position even though the at a tactical level the technology gives great advantage.

        ZHD and IamS, for the record, JMS had this to say about the new generation of shepherd races:
        The Minbari eventually make it; the Narn and Centauri do not. They don't die out, they just don't hit a state of First One-ishness, which is darn close to immortality (barring violence).
        Who knows, maybe over time they did develop a philosophical difference and entered into another cycle using the "still younger" races as pawns in their debate. I like to think not, though. I'm like to be optimistic whenever possible. Then again, I like to think a jelly doughnut qualifies as fruit and fibre, so there you have it.
        "That was the law, as set down by Valen. Three castes: worker, religious, warrior."

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        • #19
          just a thought....

          KOSH ''they are a dying people, we should let them pass''
          SINCLAIR ''who? the Narn or the Centauri?''
          KOSH ''Yes''

          Maybe the Drakh are a red herring.

          Maybe the above was actually a warning from kosh .

          Maybe the Narn and Centauri are the races which fill the roles of the Vorlons and Shadows.

          Speculation is fun isn't it.
          Duracell Bunny is arrested and charged with BATTERY!!

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          • #20
            I'd like to know what happens to humanity ?

            the Earth variety

            and the Mars variety
            Duracell Bunny is arrested and charged with BATTERY!!

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            • #21
              Originally posted by circularREASON
              I'd like to know what happens to humanity ?

              the Earth variety

              and the Mars variety
              Humans make it to First One-ishness using JMS' term from the quote above. He gave us that in "The Deconstruction of Falling Stars." at the end when the human does the ball of light thing and enters the encounter suit. I know the post I quoted above doesn't mention humans, but I'm quite sure that the context made it a given.
              "That was the law, as set down by Valen. Three castes: worker, religious, warrior."

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              • #22
                Yeh.

                But my general question is Earth and mars split.

                do the Mars humans eventually shoot off in their own direction or do all humanity share a common goal and common destiny?
                Duracell Bunny is arrested and charged with BATTERY!!

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                • #23
                  <<Maybe the Narn and Centauri are the races which fill the roles of the Vorlons and Shadows.>>

                  The quote from JMS above dissolves that particular piece of speculation.
                  Recently, there was a reckoning. It occurred on November 4, 2014 across the United States. Voters, recognizing the failures of the current leadership and fearing their unchecked abuses of power, elected another party as the new majority. This is a first step toward preventing more damage and undoing some of the damage already done. Hopefully, this is as much as will be required.

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                  • #24
                    I'd like to know what happens to humanity ?
                    see The Deconstruction of Falling Stars

                    And note the previous post where JMS is quoted as sayng that Humans eventually evolve to the level of the Vorlons & Shadows, but that the Narn & Centauri do NOT.

                    JMS ought to Know. After all, He's THE Vorlon!

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by circularREASON
                      Yeh.

                      But my general question is Earth and mars split.

                      do the Mars humans eventually shoot off in their own direction or do all humanity share a common goal and common destiny?
                      Deconstruction of Falling Stars hints that Earth Humans fell out of the common destiny by almost blasting themselves into oblivion, but the Rangers were definitely trying to bring them back into the fold.

                      The proximity of Mars makes the Earth downfall and quarantine after the near-apocalypse the more intriguing...

                      But the quarantine years during the Drakh plague may have helped isolate Earth from the rest of humanity, with lasting effects.

                      My take on this is that it's the former Earth Colonies (including Mars) that become the prime allies of the IA, with Earth becoming a sort of Centauri Prime, longing for the age when they were a big power in control of several colonies. By the same token it's the other human worlds that become a full part of the Rangers and share the sheperding destiny.

                      But a million years after the Shadow War it is apparent to me that Earth has become again part of the human comunity. Either that or it finally destroyed itself and the Ranger is taking recordings at a dead world, only from nostalgia for the craddle of humanity, not because Old Earth made it...
                      Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
                      James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

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                      • #26
                        Originally posted by Capt.Montoya
                        Deconstruction of Falling Stars hints that Earth Humans fell out of the common destiny by almost blasting themselves into oblivion, but the Rangers were definitely trying to bring them back into the fold.

                        The proximity of Mars makes the Earth downfall and quarantine after the near-apocalypse the more intriguing...

                        But the quarantine years during the Drakh plague may have helped isolate Earth from the rest of humanity, with lasting effects.

                        My take on this is that it's the former Earth Colonies (including Mars) that become the prime allies of the IA, with Earth becoming a sort of Centauri Prime, longing for the age when they were a big power in control of several colonies. By the same token it's the other human worlds that become a full part of the Rangers and share the sheperding destiny.

                        But a million years after the Shadow War it is apparent to me that Earth has become again part of the human comunity. Either that or it finally destroyed itself and the Ranger is taking recordings at a dead world, only from nostalgia for the craddle of humanity, not because Old Earth made it...
                        To be honest I didnt know what to make of DECONSTRUCTION.

                        The Ranger was watching the destruction of Earth but there always seemed to be an underlying question as regards to the humans on earth and if indeed it was eventually the earthers who obliterated themselves, and if they didnt who did?

                        also - another question if you will.

                        The Vorlon Homeworld has been left neglected for a million years after the Vorlons left. What kinda state do you think humanity is going to find it in? I mean it is not guaranteed to be a lush green planet is it? It could be near desolate.
                        Duracell Bunny is arrested and charged with BATTERY!!

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                        • #27
                          Originally posted by circularREASON
                          To be honest I didnt know what to make of DECONSTRUCTION.

                          The Ranger was watching the destruction of Earth but there always seemed to be an underlying question as regards to the humans on earth and if indeed it was eventually the earthers who obliterated themselves, and if they didnt who did?

                          also - another question if you will.

                          The Vorlon Homeworld has been left neglected for a million years after the Vorlons left. What kinda state do you think humanity is going to find it in? I mean it is not guaranteed to be a lush green planet is it? It could be near desolate.
                          In answer to your first question, we know that what was happening to the sun was not natural. I do not remember if JMS said anything more on the subject, but I suspect that since Humanity was becomming more Vorlon-like (transcending) and being under protection of the Rangers I can't imagine anyone else having destroyed the solar system except themselves.

                          My thought is that since they were moving to the Vorlon homeworld (and couldn't leave Earth to any younger races for the same reasons why Vorlon space was quarantined when they left) it was decided to make the sun go nova and wipe out the evidence.

                          Remember, there was to be a celebration on the Vorlon homeworld -- hardly something you would do if you were escaping an unplanned destruction of your own homeworld...

                          As for your second question, you must remember that humanity was transcended. What should a new homeworld look like for beings of this nature? Green fields and clear blue skies? Landscapes composed of thought and energy?

                          There are certain mysteries that we cannot understand, and to attempt it only cheapens the concept. This (IMHO) is one of them.

                          Suffice it to say that the Vorlon homeworld is eminently suited to transcended biengs, with enough working technology to have cared for the planet in the intervening ages.

                          FP

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                          • #28
                            Question:

                            Why do the Drakh ships use a Vorlon type jump engine? Why not a shadow type?


                            TWT

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                            • #29
                              Another thing:

                              Fans seem too think that humans in B5's future evolve into Vorlon like lifeformes as shown in "Deconstruction of Falling Stars". Look agian. The Ranger at the end is shown transforming into a "Lorien" kind of anergy ball, not a crystalline energy, carrot/squid like thing. I know this may be splitting hairs, but it's just bugged me all this time.

                              TWT

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                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Flynn2000
                                Question:

                                Why do the Drakh ships use a Vorlon type jump engine? Why not a shadow type?


                                TWT
                                I never noticed that.
                                But I remember they also had another type of engine, shown in A Call to Arms... a sort of "black portal" that took a ship to another point without travelling through hyperspace.
                                They may also have had the Shadow "dissolve to hyperspace" engine, in addition to jump-point engines, even if it wasn't shown.

                                The Vorlon "squid" was supposed to be their true physical shape, or a reflection of it. Similarly the million year Ranger seems completely human until he enters the encounter suit.
                                At least that's how I interpret it.
                                Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
                                James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

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