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B5-Star Trek crossover--think of the possibilities

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  • B5-Star Trek crossover--think of the possibilities

    ok, i know this argument is as old as the hair on Lorien's head, but since things seem to be on the mend between JMS and Paramount--see JMS' comment regarding their approach for him to be EP on Enterprise--I think now would be a good time to start thinking of ways to tie the two together w/o one swallowing the other up..
    Here is what i see as the big difference between the two:
    Don't get me worng, I am a fan of both series..with the exception of most of Voyager and the end of DS9--cough--cough ripoff--cough cough

    anyway, Star Trek is a Utopian vision of what we would be able to accomplish if everyone gave up what was innately human about them. In Star Trek the big change came after WW4, supposedly mankind thought since we came so close to destroying ourselves in a war, we would never allow it to happen again..I am sorry, but look at 9/11. yes for a few months all fo us forgot our differences, there was few if any problems in our country regarding racial issue. sure there were a few exceptions, but as a whole you saw humanity helping each other out. For each report of a racial incident, you saw multiple reports of ppl of different races coming to the aid of each other. But then the shock wore off, look at the world now. Are we as anxious to stamp out those who would cause the world to live in fear? to bring to justice those who would divide the world along cultural or religious lines?
    NO--every day you hear the media (the new Big Brother) telling us that what we are doing is of no account.."You must comply" "Do not think any thoughts but what we tell you"

    However, B5 was more realistic in its approach. No offense to Mr Roddenberry, but while I enjoy the concept of StarTrek, to me B5 shows what WILL happen when we reach for the stars.
    I mean you could even have told the story san the aliens, and the core concept would still be true: Mankind will go to the stars, and when we do we will take ur imperfections with us. To think anything different is to demean the human spirit. Our imperfections and the ability to overcome them is what makes us human.
    In a few hundred years, when our descendents are settling the Mars colony, or one of Jupiter's moons, What will they think when they look back to us? will they say "Our ancestors should be honored for the trials they overcame to allow us to accomplish this", or will they say "Look at what we accomplished despite the hinderance laid on us by our ancestors"?

    I hope mine will honor me, because in the end we only survive as long as we are remembered.
    well. that is my thoughts for now..let me know what you think--just be gentle ok..
    There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against such power, governments, and kingdoms, and conquerors cannot stand.
    WE WILL BE FREE!

  • #2
    i dont know how many ways you can pharaphrase, dont hold your breath, not in a million years, in your dreams etc....

    It will never happen.

    Comment


    • #3
      Jack's right. Don't confuse Paramount's interest in co-opting the competition to fix its show, or JMS's old-time fan interest in seeing the Trek franchise restored to its former glory, with a general suspension of the rules of business. Paramount may have considered using JMS to fix its show, but only to help it compete better against things like - well, B5. They would have no interest in a cross-over between the universes, which could only help the competition.

      Nor would Warner Bros., which is about to launch a major theatrical B5 film and other projects that could finally become the kind of franchise that Trek has been for Paramount be interested in helping its rival out of the hole it has dug for itself. They can't stop JMS from writing for Paramount, but they sure as hell could stop him from doing any kind of B5 connected story, becuase they own B5 and he doesn't.

      Finally I don't see how you could combine the two universes for purely practical reasons. In addition to the social differnces you point out there is the small difference that B5 at least pays lip-service to actual science whereas Trek has a magic "space drive", virtually unlimited power sources and things like transporters and "replicators". The laws of physics themselves would have to be different to allow such things to exist, according to the best guesses of modern science. Since B5 bascially follows the laws of physics that we understand, then it too would be incompatible on a fundamental level with the Trek universe.

      Regards,

      Joe
      Joseph DeMartino
      Sigh Corps
      Pat Tallman Division

      Comment


      • #4
        I can dream can't I

        Hey a guy can dream can't he?--Yeah i know the legal heaads would throw a fit..But come on, as for star trek creating fictional equipment, that is i think part of the magic that set it apart..and i would never want B5 to be a Star Trek wannabe..that would be like saying a hot dog is a ripoff of a sausage--yeah they both look the same from the outside, but i would never put a sausage on a bun with mustard,ketchup, and slaw..yech..

        But hey, Joe, i must have missed it, where did the B5 movie talk start, where can i find out about it? i have been starving for b5 since the end of the technomage trilogy..
        tks again
        There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against such power, governments, and kingdoms, and conquerors cannot stand.
        WE WILL BE FREE!

        Comment


        • #5
          I would not WANT a combination of the two "universes" even were it possible. They focus on different things, and combining them would simply rob us of alternatives.

          Not that I watch Trek anymore, but I like having the option!
          I believe that when we leave a place, part of it goes with us and part of us remains. Go anywhere in the station, when it is quiet, and just listen. After a while, you will hear the echoes of all our conversations, every thought and word we've exchanged. Long after we are gone .. our voices will linger in these walls for as long as this place remains. But I will admit .. that the part of me that is going .. will very much miss the part of you that is staying.

          Comment


          • #6
            Since B5 bascially follows the laws of physics that we understand, then it too would be incompatible on a fundamental level with the Trek universe.
            I'm trying to imagine Garibaldi's response to Commander Tucker explaining the transporter system to him. "You're fraggin' with me, right?"

            Or something else unprintable along those lines.



            Aisling

            Comment


            • #7
              Your dream would be my nightmare Ranger 6 and 7/8...

              To me the hand waving pseudo-science technobabble indeed set Star Trek appart... and not in a good place. Yes it was magic, but magic belongs in fantasy, not in science fiction.

              And when it comes to the dramatic aspects of the story B5 is more realistic too in my opinion. Just compare ST's Federation to B5's Earth Alliance... Is not only the science-fictional aspects that are incompatible.

              I think that the Star Trek Universe could win something, but the Babylon 5 Universe would loose more.

              The movie talk came from a post of JMS giving the acronym TMoS, that set a lot of speculation, the thread "if the new project is about the Telepath Wars..." is just one example.
              There was a lot of speculation about the title but we now know that TMoS is The Memory of Shadows.
              Such... is the respect paid to science that the most absurd opinions may become current, provided they are expressed in language, the sound of which recalls some well-known scientific phrase
              James Clerk Maxwell (1831-79)

              Comment


              • #8
                Your suggestion has caused me physical pain.

                That is all.
                Radhil Trebors
                Persona Under Construction

                Comment


                • #9
                  One of the main benefits of a Babylon 5 - Star Trek crossover is that Ivanova could kill Janeway, with lots of pain.
                  Andrew Swallow

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    IM sure Garabaldi would ride sevn of nine like a mule given the chance. That should really lighten her character up a bit. I always said all Seven had to do was get laid and shed some of that monotone characterness, and Garabaldi would be just the man.

                    On a more serious note im pretty convinced that the whole JMS thing to paramount wasnt to write a B5 Trek mix more to write a whole new trek show altogether. I think JMS given the amount of resources that Trek has would make one hell of a fantastic show but only given certain cercumstances. 1 being if he had free will to do whatever he pleased. That will never happen and he knows it. He thought the execs over at TNT were bad...2 there is always big brother trek. He probably loved Star Trek back in the day and it hurts him, like it hurts all trek fans, to see the franchise doing as poorly as it is doing. He sat down, probably had a few beers with one of his buds and hammered out a neat premise. Now hes mentioned it in public and people think hes going to go work for trek. It will never happen as much as id like to see it.

                    On a trek note i caught the pilot of Odyseyy 5 the other day which was created by Trek head writer Manny Coto. What a neat ingenious show. TOo bad it got cancelled after 1 year.

                    Joe, how do you know the new B5 project is a threatrical release?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      don't get me wrong...

                      Guys, don't get me wrong. I would never want the two to meld into one. I was speaking more along the lines of a one-shot.. Much like the Marvel/DC or Star Trek/X-Men..I mean it would not be hard for them to coexist for that amount of time. You have the whole other timeline way of explaining it all away. You have to admit it would be way cool to see President or Captain Sheridan slap that stiff English grin off of Captain Picards face. I also think that Worf and G'kar would hit it off.. Then the fun part would be seeing Lyta mindwipe Troi into thinking she was a lesbian chicken in love with Vir..
                      Anyway, logistics aside what would you like to see if they did happen to do one? think serious or funny
                      loads of love all around--(whispering in manly voice) in a strictly heterosexual way
                      There is no greater power in the universe than the need for freedom. Against such power, governments, and kingdoms, and conquerors cannot stand.
                      WE WILL BE FREE!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Oh, a one-off!

                        It is already being done. Watch the trailor. Quite a hoot, indeed!

                        Of course, this is ST:TOS. Kind of.
                        I believe that when we leave a place, part of it goes with us and part of us remains. Go anywhere in the station, when it is quiet, and just listen. After a while, you will hear the echoes of all our conversations, every thought and word we've exchanged. Long after we are gone .. our voices will linger in these walls for as long as this place remains. But I will admit .. that the part of me that is going .. will very much miss the part of you that is staying.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Joe, how do you know the new B5 project is a threatrical release?
                          At one point when JMS was still being extremely coy about the whole thing he posted that if he gave any more obvious hints that the powers that be would use his head to make a "2:35:1 hole in the wall".

                          2.35:1 is the widest common theatrical apsect ratio, used for films with an "epic" feel like Star Wars, Titanci and The Lord of the Rings. The other common theatrical ratio is 1.85:1, used for most comedies and more "intimate" dramas.) 2.35:1 is absolutely never used for television, where the standard ratio is 1.33:1 and the HDTV widescreen standard is 1.77:1. (The TV ratios are often written as 4:3 and 16:9, but that makes them harder to compare to film aspect ratios.) Anyway, by specifying a "2.35:1" hole, JMS pretty much said "The project is a theatrical movie" without technically spilling the beans. And he's never contradicted any of the fan posts concluding that it had to be a big screen film, whereas he has steered fans away from speculation about a new series or an animated project or other wrong guesses in the past.

                          Babylon 5: The Memory of Shadows undoubtedly be a theatrical film Warner Bros. was very interested in doing a big screen, original cast B5 moviie bak in 1998 and 1999 and went as far as paying JMS to write a treament. That was when Crusade was just cranking up, and WB expected to have that on the air for five years, and they had visions of a Trek-like franchise with the original cast carrying the feature films while Crusade told its story, with maybe something like Rangers coming along around 2003 to continue the saga. Then the break with TNT came, Crusade was scapped before it ever air, Netter Digital went under the fan club folded, the magazine ceased publication and the VHS tapes and laserdiscs suddenly stopped selling. The only thing missing were locusts and the slaying of the first born.

                          WB understandably lost interest in spending 50 million bucks or so making a B5 feature, and their experience with the Rangers pilot and Sci-Fi did nothing to change their minds.

                          The success of the DVDs did however. They know how much money those made. They can project how much a theatrical film with most of the original cast will make theatrically, on pay per view and cable and on home video, and if they control the costs there's no way they can lose. And with a theatrical film, as opposed to a TV series, they aren't depedent on others to distribute and market the project. Financially it is probably a no-brainer. And with the success of the DVDs and genre films like LotR and Harry Potter (both of which they own a piece of) WB is probably once again thinking "franchise" and long term plans for B5. Considering that some of us practically had to hold a gun to their heads to release the DVDs in the first place, I have to chuckle about the whole thing.

                          Regards,

                          Joe
                          Joseph DeMartino
                          Sigh Corps
                          Pat Tallman Division

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Well a lot like the Trek franchise, if it is a feature film, the sucess of said film will probably have a lot to do with weather or not anything more gets filmed or not. I would love to see more of course, but if the movie goes to the box office and only makes 10 million during its stint then we wont be seeing more b5. If it makes around 35-40 million then maybe. I dont see 35-40 being out of reach but i would put money on around 25 million if it made it to the box office. It also depends on when they feel like releasing a movie.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Capt.Montoya
                              Your dream would be my nightmare Ranger 6 and 7/8...

                              To me the hand waving pseudo-science technobabble indeed set Star Trek appart... and not in a good place. Yes it was magic, but magic belongs in fantasy, not in science fiction.

                              And when it comes to the dramatic aspects of the story B5 is more realistic too in my opinion. Just compare ST's Federation to B5's Earth Alliance... Is not only the science-fictional aspects that are incompatible.

                              I think that the Star Trek Universe could win something, but the Babylon 5 Universe would loose more.
                              IMO, the fantasy/s-f argument is a bit weak in many places, since at the current level of technology, setting the line between SF and Fantasy is often very subjective. Still the hand waving pseude-science technobabble was still the main problem in ST (mostly post-TOS series, granted, I've only seen a handful of those, but they were eminent even in the small number of eps I saw) - technobabble became an easy way to resolve a storyline. Oh, the borg are attacking - we'll just modify the reflector dish to emit a series high-tachyon kamangabobo's and destroy them. B5 never, ever used a Deus Ex Machina to resolve a story. JMS has even stated he would avoid technobabble solutions to problems multiple times.

                              On-topic, though, I agree with the previous posters. ST is currently to weak (story-quality) a franchise, and B5 is too well developed to have them somehow tie in. One would just bring down another.

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