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  • How will JMS adapt now in TMoS?

    Since I'm the one who said that the Biggs thread wasn't the place to discuss how his passing might affect the TMoS storyline, I figured I should start the tread I said should be started.

    So here we can talk about how JMS will adapt to this terrible loss.

    To begin I'm going to quote some of the statements made in the other thread:

    on 5/24/04 RCModeler wrote:
    Let's face it... the Doctor was not an important character. Subtract him from the Shadow War arc, and nothing really changes. (Sadly, the same is true for the doctors on the Star Treks too...except McCoy.)

    on 5/24/04 Nachtswerg wrote:
    I agree that Franklin's absence could be handled pretty easily in the movie, but I'm a little uncomfortable with his character being referred to as 'not important'. I understand what RC meant, but it read wrong.

    The addiction storyline, along with the way that Biggs portrayed the character were very important to the overall story, if you ask me. It gave the grand tableau another piece of its intimate heart.
    more to come in the next post....
    Anthony Flessas
    Writer/Producer/Director,
    SP Pictures


    I have no avatar! I walk in mystery and need nothing to represent who and what I am!

  • #2
    more post quotes...

    on 5/24/04 Joseph DeMartino wrote:
    And if the Shadow War were all there were to B5 you might have a point, but it isn't.

    Subtract Franklin from the from the Earth Civil War arc and lots of things change - mostly for the worse. Like maybe the Mars resistance doesn't join up with Sheridan, the Teepsicles don't get used as weapons and neither Garibaldi nor Sheridan might have makes it to the victory party. (They needed Garibaldi to save Sheridan, and only Franklin's intervention saved G's life.)

    Franklin was critical in all those areas, succeeding with Number One where Marcus left her underwhelmed, and using her support to win over the other resistance leaders. (Not to mention going far beyond what Sheridan authorized him to say and lying his butt off to close the deal, something Marcus was unlikely to have attempted.)

    Easy to forget what small moments great events can turn on.

    Franklin is a friend and advisor to most of the non-Corps key players in the Teep War - to Sheridan and Delenn, to the Earth President, to Garibaldi and to Lyta. (He treated her much better than Sheridan did, and risked much to help the telepaths when he had nothing at all to gain for doing so - simply because it was the right thing to do.)

    So I think that any way you slice it Franklin - as well as Rick Biggs - is going to be a noticable absence in the next B5 project, no matter what it is.

    Regards,

    Joe
    and....

    on 5/24/04 Capt.Montoya wrote:
    Interesting how the death of "Franklin's Dad" and "Dr. Franklin" will now be linked in many fan's memory, when the real relationships between the two actors was completely incidental...

    The character of Dr. Franklin indeed participated in many pivotal moments.
    Considering how Lyta's arc was transfered to Talia and back to Lyta and how Ivanova's arc was later split between Lochley and Lyta (among other things) I think that how the arc may have progressed without him could be an interesting speculation... but right now doesn't seem the time.

    I think that both Franklin and Biggs fed of each other, as Bigss performed his role so well his character, Franklin, was given a bigger role, beyond the MedLab, giving Biggs a greater chance to show his acting talent.
    He delivered.
    B5 was better for it.
    Dr. Franklin was a great character...

    I also hope that B5:TMoS will feature an "in memoriam" for him.
    next came....

    on 5/24/04 colonyearth wrote:
    Thank you Joe for saying that before I could.

    Anyone who thinks that Dr. Franklin (and Rick Biggs) was a replaceable, superfluous, or in any way unimportant character in the B5 universe, needs to seriously sit down and watch all five seasons again. He was integral in each story arc...as was each character.

    Franklin was always the humanist...the one fighting to preserve life and its sanctity. Now someone else will have to speak for him.

    And if the CRUSADE arc was going to have anything to do with TMoS as JMS vaguely hinted recently might be the case, then his character might and probably well would have played an important part in the story. I've always contended that JMS will write very important roles for each of the original cast to play in TMoS so as to give the fans a sense that each and every beloved character was there in a big way.

    I can't help thinking how much it will feel as if someone very important, an important voice if you will, will be missing when TMoS hits the theatres.

    I know JMS will be able to re-write it and in such a way that we'll think it was always intended to be that way (he did it so many times during B5's run). But we will know why and what happened and we will know that one of the voices in the chorus that is the B5 cast is sadly missing.

    We know that Dr. Franklin lived for many years...but from now on we will always have to write around his presence in all future B5 ventures. And that means that voice will always be silent, even when it would've been needed.

    The impact of this is more important I think than some of you realize.

    We are all truly diminished by this loss.

    CE
    on 5/24/04 B5_Obsessed wrote:

    Seeing how JMS lovingly eulogized Mr Kitty on Crusade, I'm sure Richard Biggs will merit a memorial message, assuming B5:TMoS really happens.

    I always thought the memorial for the Challenger crew at the opening of Star Trek IV was a classy touch.
    on 5/24/04 colonyearth wrote: \
    Re: Memorium

    quote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by B5_Obsessed
    Seeing how JMS lovingly eulogized Mr Kitty on Crusade, I'm sure Richard Biggs will merit a memorial message, assuming B5:TMoS really happens.

    I always thought the memorial for the Challenger crew at the opening of Star Trek IV was a classy touch.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------



    I'm certain there will be a dedication of the film to Rick.

    What do you mean by "assuming B5:TMoS really happens"? Uh, it's a done deal and will go on...unfortunately without Rick, which will remind us of his absence yes, but will also be a celebration of his life and how he has touched us all.

    CE
    Then came....

    on 5/25/04 RCmodeler wrote:
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino
    And if the Shadow War were all there were to B5 you might have a point, but it isn't.
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    (sigh)

    I wish people would read what I WRITE, and not insert stuff I did not say. I never said the Shadow War was the "only" thing to B5. Strawman arguments are cheap arguments. Don't use them.

    Anyway...

    If JMS could subtract the MAIN CHARACTER, Sinclair, and B5 still survive, I'm sure he could subtract a minor character like Dr.Franklin. It would be similar to how he killed off Talia and replaced her with Lyta. Sad. Tragic. But in the long term, not a great difference in the 5-year plot.

    Back to the movie/project...

    Franklin is probably there in JMS' story, but I'm sure he could easily be removed without too much trouble or impact. He was a minor/not-necessary character in the stand-alone movies (River of Souls, Thirdspace, etcetera), and I'm sure the same is true for the theatrical movie.

    Who knows? Maybe JMS will use that cute Indian doctor.

    Now all previous mentions have been reposted to here.

    Discuss away but please remain respectful.

    CE
    Anthony Flessas
    Writer/Producer/Director,
    SP Pictures


    I have no avatar! I walk in mystery and need nothing to represent who and what I am!

    Comment


    • #3
      I dont think this will require that exstensive of a rewrite. We know from Sleeping in the light that the good doctor is still around when the end comes for Sheridan, so his character cannot be killed off in the new movie or mentioned there of. I would guess that the good doctor will be back on earth doing his research on inter speices cross contamination during the new project. He may have had a small part in the new story but JMS will most likely leave his character out of this project instead of trying to replace him with another actor.

      A memorial to Richard at the begining or at the end of the movie would be most appropriate and apprieciated by all. As for the Ides of May annoucement, well that may be put off by the recent loss to allow time to edit the script and renegotiate a few details if Richards Character played a part of the new project.

      Just my 2 cents

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by SciFiRanger
        I dont think this will require that exstensive of a rewrite. We know from Sleeping in the light that the good doctor is still around when the end comes for Sheridan, so his character cannot be killed off in the new movie or mentioned there of. I would guess that the good doctor will be back on earth doing his research on inter speices cross contamination during the new project. He may have had a small part in the new story but JMS will most likely leave his character out of this project instead of trying to replace him with another actor.

        A memorial to Richard at the begining or at the end of the movie would be most appropriate and apprieciated by all. As for the Ides of May annoucement, well that may be put off by the recent loss to allow time to edit the script and renegotiate a few details if Richards Character played a part of the new project.

        Just my 2 cents
        i agree with SciFiRanger.

        i don't think it will be too hard for JMS to work around the unfortunate tragedy of Mr. Biggs' death. these things do happen, unfortunately. just think back to The Twilight Zone movie when Vic Morrow was killed on the set during shooting that helicopter sequence.

        Dr. Franklin will probably remain an unseen character from now on. and i can't see them hiring another actor to replace him either.
        Keffer

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Joseph DeMartino
          I also hope that B5:TMoS will feature an "in memoriam" for him.
          Funny, that was the second thing I thought of, when I heard about his death. Knowing JMS, it's almost a certainty.

          But certainly, it will add a good deal of time to the release of TMoS, since the script will have to be rewritten, and so on.
          Last edited by Stunaep; 05-25-2004, 01:55 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            In the Telepath War Dr Franklin may have been a friend and ally to Lyta. If the Psi Cops keep visiting Dr Franklin he would be too dangerous to visit. So any thing he would have said can be changed to email read out by Lyta or Sheridan. A second doctor can do any medical work.
            Andrew Swallow

            Comment


            • #7
              It's hard to say how much delay there'll be to TMoS as we don't know what size, if any, his character had in the story. If Dr. Franklin was destined to be only a minor character, then only a minimal re-write would be needed, probably not taking more than a week or two to complete. Though, if Franklin was destined to be a major player in the story, it would certainly take JMS a little while longer to rework the script.

              I think the only question now is, will any of this rewriting affect the timetable for the announcement of the project?
              Got movies? www.filmbuffonline.com

              Comment


              • #8
                <I think the only question now is, will any of this rewriting affect the timetable for the announcement of the project?>

                That is the question of the moment and being caught between tick and tock your guess is as good as mine.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Personally, I think jms should kill him off rather than ''ghost'' him.

                  Better to die......

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    When is this movie going to be released?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Umm.......how can he kill him off unless the movie takes place *at least* 21 years after SiL?? It is known canon that Franklin is alive and well in 2282......"Ghosting" him, as you put it, is the only option (replacing him notwithstanding, and I don't thinimho JMS would do that)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        JMS knows, the hard way, how to handle the loss of actors to the show. I think it may take longer for him to steel himself to the task of writing out Biggs than it will take him to accomplish it. I wouldn't want to be in his shoes - it will be like losing Rick again.

                        But the script will be little altered in its main structure (e.g. probably no set changes), I should think, and that shouldn't hold up pre-production.
                        I believe that when we leave a place, part of it goes with us and part of us remains. Go anywhere in the station, when it is quiet, and just listen. After a while, you will hear the echoes of all our conversations, every thought and word we've exchanged. Long after we are gone .. our voices will linger in these walls for as long as this place remains. But I will admit .. that the part of me that is going .. will very much miss the part of you that is staying.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          At this point any promo stuff that's been generated for the announcement, that had any pictures of Richard on them wold have to be redone and re printed. If they've even got to that point yet. It would hold up things for a short time but with the news of his passing being so recent they may just want to wait a short time to make the announcement out of respect. No reason to drown out the sad news with a big to do over the new project.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Writing 101

                            There are many ways to keep the Dr. Franklin character alive by using the many off-screen writing techniques that other shows have used.

                            Examples:

                            A quick flashback montage using old footage.

                            "Dr. Franklin sent me to tell you that..."

                            "Dr. Franklin couldn't be here so I have come to..."

                            "I just received a message from Dr. Franklin that said..."

                            "I just got word that Dr. Franklin..."

                            Then, thanks to the world of digital editing:

                            A short audio or vidscreen message of a few seconds or so before it's "cut-off" or "interference". This could be expensive but might be good for one important scene to set up the off-screen scenario.

                            The fans would then spend hours upon hours trying to figure out where the footage was taken from.

                            But there can't be a *digital Dr. Franklin* ala The Matrix or George Lucas.

                            So Dr. Franklin will live on, if only mentioned in any new projects. But in the B5 universe he *is* still alive and has to be because of Sleeping In Light.

                            It *is* really sad, however.
                            Last edited by DDC2000; 05-25-2004, 08:50 PM.
                            Visitor from another time-space-distortion-anomaly...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              They cant give an inmemorandum for Franklin on the show because in shadows of light he was there to celebrate the passing of sheridan. SO unless they do a show that is based after Shadows Franklin is alive and well. Unfourtunatly they are probably going to acknowledge him as being earthside, and even that is at best.

                              Now my idea would be to create a character named Richard Biggs, have him die heroically and give a memorial to that name. DOnt center a movie or show around him but 5 minutes will get the message across.

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