TLT Sales Numbers?

[NotSoWize]

I have been scouring the net for some DVD sales chart that actually shows that B5:TLT sold some copies, but I have not found any chart that lists TLT at all. Have any sales figures been released? Has JMS or anyone else had any sort of statement regarding early sales? Aside from the Amazon.com numbers, I haven't been able to find anything that would point to strong (or weak for that matter) sales so far.

[SmileOfTheShadow]

I have been scouring the net for some DVD sales chart that actually shows that B5:TLT sold some copies, but I have not found any chart that lists TLT at all. Have any sales figures been released? Has JMS or anyone else had any sort of statement regarding early sales? Aside from the Amazon.com numbers, I haven't been able to find anything that would point to strong (or weak for that matter) sales so far.

We've all been scratching our heads wondering the same thing. JMS has been silent so far.

Jon

[Jan]

Of course, everybody on the moderated newsgroup is silent right now since Jay and Cheryl are in the process of moving. Hopefully it won't be for too long.

Jan

[Milkman]

I have not gotten any info either... but i do think the-numbers info is based only on information that has been released by the studios. My guess would be they are not releasing the info. Which of course leads to why... and that leads me to think that way they can make their decision on the next DVD for any reason they wish and blame it on poor sales.

Really why hide sales numbers on some DVD's and not others? I can only think of not nice reasons...

[babylonlurker]

I have not gotten any info either... but i do know the-numbers info is based only on information that has been released by the studios. My guess would be they are not releasing the info. Which of course leads to why... and that leads me to think that way they can make their decision on the next DVD for any reason they wish and blame it on poor sales.

Really why hide sales numbers on some DVD's and not others? I can only think of not nice reasons...

On the other hand , the DVD has not yet been released in Region2 (*hate* that) so how can yo get any reliable sales figures - after all it's only 2 weeks after the release

[Jan]

Really why hide sales numbers on some DVD's and not others? I can only think of not nice reasons...

Never ascribe to malice what can adequately be explained by stupidity. After all, look at the 'marketing' effort expended by WB for TLT (read: none to speak of). Once again, WB has taken the timid 'let's test the waters first' approach to B5.

One of the sites I saw said that they got info from brick-and-morter stores only, not the studios which wouldn't include most online sites. I'd think that info from the studios would be more accurate overall but might also significantly delayed since they'd have to gather it from disparate sources.

Jan

[Milkman]

True... maybe im just cranky this morning.

As for the region 2 thing... that sucks. But they could still release numbers of what was bought last week... i know they have the stats somewhere.

[Shabaz]

TLT hasn't really shown up in any of the big tracking agency's public numbers (Nielsen's VideoScan, Rentrak's Retail Essentials). I've seen numbers down to 10.000 units per week for the second week TLT was out, without TLT on it. And the-numbers I believe does do some retail tracking themselves, though it is more minimal than the big ones. And they had a chart down to 20.000 for TLT's first week, without TLT on it. So TLT sold under 20.000 units first week according to them.

I have been hearing that retail shipments to a lot of stores was fairly minimal though, and one had to make quite a bit of active effort at some places to get ones hand on a disc. That coupled with the apparent lack of any marketing does make one wonder how WB figures a show that hasn't had a television run first is supposed to find its audience. Looking at the original DVD sales number, B5 has a a decent crowd that might buy it, but I really do think it's a small subset that really hang out in places like this or the newsgroup, or that would otherwise actively seek out B5 news. And if you don't, the news that B5:TLT is out now and that it even exists could've very easily passed you by, I think.

[Truth66]

I totally agree with Shabaz. There wasn't much of a promotion campaign for TLT and many wouyldn't have heard that it was even being produced let alone released. Then again B5 was never really promoted that well from day one compared with other shows.
With regards to the number of discs being available in stores, well I've already posted in a different thread with regards to my nightmare nearly becoming a reality and having a great deal of trouble trying to find a copy.
I think that what ever the sales figures end up being, I'm sure they could've been far greater had it been properly marketed. People can't buy what they don't know about.

[Biggs]

..well taking all the above into account, playing devils advocate here for Warners; The DVD content, storyline etc is pretty much hard-aimed at existing B5 fans and not expanding on that core group, so their marketing is pretty much what I expected given the story, characters and so forth are aimed solely at the exisiting fanbase. It wasn't a huge-scale production for a new audience, it was targeting at the core-fan base. Not the wider audience.

So taking that into account I can see why they've done little to nothing in terms of wider marketing. Therefore, sales figures against Movies and television series with 10x the budget TLT had, it's like comparing an old Goat with a Elephant...they're completely different things.

I would say, based on nothing other than what I can assume, they'll take more note of Amazon and other online-retail figures, because they will assume that the core-b5 audience will seek out the product, and not the other way around...which they have...so they'll base TLT's success on Amazon.com sales and outside retailers or internet video retailers overseas.

I doubt they were expecting it to shake the ground up against mainstream DVD sales against hollywood blockbusters etc...thats totally unreasonable.

It's also not a reason for us to be dissappointed...I think the pre-sales on Amazon was reason enough that there is demand out there, keep in mind we're paying for something that previously we got for free on Television for 5 years a loooong time ago.

[Shabaz]

They could've taken out some targeted ads on something like SciFi channel, beyond the super short ad I heard about. Even if it is only aimed at those already fans, like I said, I'm pretty sure the vast, vast majority doesn't keep up with B5 news like us. And beyond some fairly brief articles in some niche SF magazines, the news could've very easily passed you by, even as a B5 fan, because of the lack of marketing. The nature of it being this new direct-to-dvd thing seems to necessitate giving it some awareness in terms of mindshare, though I can understand that with the really small budget TLT had, any sort of marketing could balloon up the expenses significantly. But I think a little bit extra wouldn't have hurt.

I am really curious how much was sold by Amazon though. My thoughts are that it probably skews a lot to, well, people who would buy DVDs online months in advance, and that it might just be that the hardcore crowd happened to end buying in a really concentrated fashion from one retailer. Maybe a pessimistic interpretation, but I'm almost starting to wonder if we didn't get a bit too exited over the high Amazon sales rank.

I guess what I'm really saying is that I hope JMS will be able to give us some concrete news on sales number soon.

[Jan]

I guess what I'm really saying is that I hope JMS will be able to give us some concrete news on sales number soon.

The most concrete news JMS has ever been able to give us has been on the order of (paraphrasing but reasonably accurate) 'They sold a gazillion of the season DVDs (and did you know that there are 15 zeros in 'gazillion'?)' [and he made that last up, btw].

One very nice ad was that WB took the entire back cover of the big (and I mean BIG) keepsake program at SDCC.

Jan

[Tim_Fleming]

Here is what I surmise.

A prior post indicated that down to 10,000 units sold in the first week of release TLT was not on the list of bestsellers.

Now you can count me first among Babylon 5 pessimists. I've been burned watching other B5 sequel projects get killed at birth. It has made me quite skepticle about the longterm success of any Babylon 5 project. However I refuse to believe that less than 10,000 units moved in th efirst week of release. These tracking websites note that their data is incomplete and that studios don't disclose all their numbers.

This means that TLT sales have simply not been disclosed. Geez, there are over 1000 Best Buy stores in the USA and Canada, if each one sold just 10 TLTs then that would account for 10,000 right there. This just doesn't add up does it?

[Shabaz]

Here is what I surmise.

A prior post indicated that down to 10,000 units sold in the first week of release TLT was not on the list of bestsellers.

Now you can count me first among Babylon 5 pessimists. I've been burned watching other B5 sequel projects get killed at birth. It has made me quite skepticle about the longterm success of any Babylon 5 project. However I refuse to believe that less than 10,000 units moved in th efirst week of release. These tracking websites note that their data is incomplete and that studios don't disclose all their numbers.

This means that TLT sales have simply not been disclosed. Geez, there are over 1000 Best Buy stores in the USA and Canada, if each one sold just 10 TLTs then that would account for 10,000 right there. This just doesn't add up does it?

Tracking agencies don't depend on disclosure by studios. Their entire reason of existence is that they take actual retail numbers, and then do some statistical extrapolation for any stores they don't actively track. I'm personally more familiar with the game industry, and companies like the NPD for the US, who IIRC actually track like 60% of the US retail stores, with I think Wallmart being one of the big ones they don't get, and for which they have to extrapolate. Furthermore, retail trackers are actually the people payed by the big industry players to get sell-through rates, where the studio itself would initially only have access to sold-into-retail numbers.

edit: Just to be clear, talking about the two big players I mentioned before: VideoScan and Rentrak. The-numbers is indeed a less than perfect source, but I have seen charts based on VideoScan's data going down to 10.000 for TLT's second week that didn't have it on it (forgot to look at it for the first week though).

edit: And I just did, and tlt is on there for the week ending on August 5. Woohooo! Also, I think I may have misinterpreted that short chart I was looking at for the second week, though it's a mistake I'm happy to make.

[Shabaz]

And here's the chart. Now, 1.29% of 300's number may seem low, but this was 300's first week on sale, and it apparently opened huge. Can't quickly find Nielsen's number for 300 though, so if anyone can help me look for that.


Shot at 2007-08-15