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  • what's wrong with this list?,,2003...037541,00.html

  • #2
    You mean other than:
    (a) a couple too many Veerhoven movies?
    (b) an unhealthy fascination with current sci-fi TV without paying any homage to the true originals? (as much as I like Heroes and Lost, they ain't made any lists yet)
    (c) Clone Wars? Yeesh.
    (d) Written like the authors had just surveyed a bunch of message boards, came off with a "hot list", sprinkled in current stuff because they didn't recognize half of it, and pushed it out half-baked and cheesy like EVERY OTHER TOP WHATEVER SCI-FI LIST EVER MADE?
    (e) Oh, yeah, there's something missing from it......

    Radhil Trebors
    Persona Under Construction


    • #3
      25 - V - Should be HIGHER damn it.
      24 - Galaxy Quest - Sure - I can see their point.
      23 - Dr Who - Perhaps tied with Twilight Zone for showing the power of content over efects quality.
      22 - Quantum Leap - Human Drama by way of teleporting. Best Bit - HARDLY ANYTHING but the finale. Good lord - damn near perfect execution.
      21 - Futurama - OK now, this does not belong.
      20 - Clone Wars - ONLY included because of how it shines next to 1-3. Does not qualify on it's own.
      19 - Starship Troopers - They nailed it - parody of jingo themed political efforts since time began - and when ever it will end.
      18 - HEROES - FFS! It's not over. Might end up being great, good, or spin out of control into crap ( ALAIS - I'm looking at you! ) - NO UNFINISHED WORKS!
      17 - ESSM - One of the few have not seen.
      16 - Total Recall - Too campy to be serious.
      15 - Firefly - Dialog + Character + Setting = Too complex for Fox Exec's.
      14 - Children of Men - One of the best 'Day After Tomorrow' society commentaries IMHO.
      13 - Terminator - High concept - flawless direction and innovative use of mid-budget effects.
      12 - Back to the Future - Spielberg at his comedic, relationship, sci-fi and action blending peak. Never mixed so many elements as well again.
      11 - LOST - SEE 18 FFS!!!!!!
      10 - The Thing - External threat turning man against man. Chosen and divided loyalties when the stakes are highest. Absolutely pitch perfect physical, in-camera effects as well.
      9 - Aliens - Not better Sci-Fi than Alien. Better Action, more obvious social commentary by way of Yppie bashing. Not better Sci-Fi.
      8 - ST:TNG - Better entertainment on virtually every measurable level than the original - but not better Sci-Fi.
      7 - ET - Boy and his dog hits the post 70's divorce zietgiest.
      6 - Brazil - Also not seen - Don't shoot me.
      5 - Kahn!! - Most potent of the films, but I think 1 is much better Sci-Fi. Also good when I am having trouble sleeping.
      4 - X-Files - Proof that the Twilight Zone rotating topic of the week could be mixed with a static cast and at some early point - interesting over-arching theme.
      3 - Blade Runner - The price of creating then discarding perfection when we become jealous of it.
      2 - BSG - Closest to agreeing with this of all the IN PROCESS on list - BUT IT'S STILL IN PROCESS!!!!
      1 - Matrix - Whoa......

      And YES - the obvious point of your post is NO B5. In a list 25 long it obviously belongs. Some would put it at #1, top 5 top 10 - etc. But personal opinions aside - it MOST DEF belongs WELL before Futurama!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Of Course - All IMHO.........
      Last edited by FredScuttle; 05-04-2007, 12:58 PM.
      I am a man of a not insignificant build. Standing 6'1, 205 lbs with a good more of that muscle than chub. Aged some 36 years, I can - if I choose - put on an imposing aura. There are - however - 22 words that can reduce me to a quivering mass of weeping tears. A pitiful semblance of a 5 year old boy who just watched his puppy get ran over in the street. Those words? - As for Delenn, every morning for as long as she lived, Delenn got up before dawn and watched the sun come up


      • #4
        Just read the list a little while ago when it arrived in the current EW, and my initial reasponse, aside from 'Where the hell is B5?'- is it seemed to be cobbled together by a number of people, many of whom had only been watching SF for the last five years or so. Heroes? Lost? Children of Men? Nothing against any of those projects, but let's wait to see if they stand the test of time. As somebody who basically his living in the genre, I generally don't pay much attention to these lists, because they're rarely written by people who have a comprehensive knowledge of SF genre, and frankly, why should I accept the opinions of a small group of people who probably aren't as well-versed as I, or many of the people who populate this site are?


        • #5
          Some would put it at #1, top 5 top 10 - etc. But personal opinions aside - it MOST DEF belongs WELL before Futurama!!!
          Not getting the Futurama disses. That show did more spoofing - and better - of the best of scifi in a half-hour than Galaxy Quest did making fun of Trek-dom for it's entire showing. It's earned it's spot on a few lists.
          Radhil Trebors
          Persona Under Construction


          • #6
            Also no Red Dwarf 8'-(

            greetings from austria, best known for its history and fine wine... feels like a wine cellar on a graveyard 8-)


            • #7
              These lists...

              Ya know, the sure-to-be time-honored adage "Opinions are like assholes; everybody's got one and they all stink" can be applied here.
              Recently, there was a reckoning. It occurred on November 4, 2014 across the United States. Voters, recognizing the failures of the current leadership and fearing their unchecked abuses of power, elected another party as the new majority. This is a first step toward preventing more damage and undoing some of the damage already done. Hopefully, this is as much as will be required.


              • #8
                Originally posted by Radhil View Post
                Not getting the Futurama disses. That show did more spoofing - and better - of the best of scifi in a half-hour than Galaxy Quest did making fun of Trek-dom for it's entire showing. It's earned it's spot on a few lists.
                Futurama is definitely a great comedy series, but I don't think I'd put it in a top X list of science fiction. I actually liked Galaxy Quest, too, but I'd probably categorize them as comedy before science fiction.

                I liked the Matrix movies, but I definitely wouldn't put them at the top of any list, other than maybe for special effects. The fight scenes are entertaining, but they take up a pretty large percentage of the screen time.


                • #9
                  Originally posted by LessonInMachismo View Post
                  These lists...

                  Ya know, the sure-to-be time-honored adage "Opinions are like assholes; everybody's got one and they all stink" can be applied here.
                  AGREED 100%


                  ok maybe i should stop there

                  no i can't

                  ...this list was obviously made by someone who watches tv and movies, not by someone who understands sci-fi, some of the selections are no-brainers Doctor Who, ST:TNG. Aliens(god i love that movie) should be on ANYONES top 25 of the last 25
                  Futurama, V, Quantum Leap,Heroes, X-Files (not a scifi show by the way) do not belong

                  things like B5, DS9, Stargate should be, from a sci-fi view Riddick/Pitch Black belong much more then Starship troopers or the matrix(how can we update he mytical jesus story) and a whole host of others that should recive mentions before some of the trash on that list

                  now Gal Quest - i literally fell out of my chair in the theater when i saw this the first time, and i rarely will spend money to see a movie twice on the big screen, i saw this 4 times and this could have a very good argumnt to make a top 25 list but i can't say yes or no

                  ok thats enough of my 2cents and horrid spelling


                  • #10
                    EW has never dealt with SCIFI properly (Unless you talk about Firefly which they love JW)...How does a cancelled TV propery (Firefly) beat B5 - it just doesn't (and let me tell you I do LOVE serenity/firefly)... 13 eps does not beat 5 years...

                    B5 has NEVER received any credit from them.

                    Shows like 24, Heroes, Jericho, and BSG own much of their arc stories to shows like B5 that did it before others did.

                    I cancelled my subscription a few years ago since I have very little in common with their critics and complete liberal stance on everything (not that I care about others "opinions" but will respect). This top 25 list proves that!!!

                    A magazine such as EW should concentrate on Entertainment not public opinion. Right now many people are saying that BSG is the best scifi and although I keep watching I think it pales in comparison to Farscape and B5 (which should be top 5 in last 25).. I really just keep hoping it gets better.

                    I remember watching B5 and FS for the first time and thinking "I have never seen this before, this is COOL!!" -- now when I watch BSG I get that funny taste in my mouth that although some good eps exist, there are many filler and non-vitale stories that just irritate me to hell... with B5 every week was something special with so few fillers that I feel it is something of an underestimated product...The B5 ARC kept in motion throughout, as BSG goes on tangents that don't make sense at times...

                    I wouldn't be surprised if the B5 dvd is mentioned in a tiny paragragh in EW and never an article will exist... or review...


                    • #11
                      My list:

                      01. Firefly (2002)
                      02. Babylon 5 (1993-1998)
                      03. Star Wars Episode VI: Return of the Jedi (1983)
                      04. Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country (1991)
                      05. The Terminator (1984)
                      06. Blade Runner (1982)
                      07. Alien³ (1991)
                      08. Akira (1988)
                      09. 12 Monkeys (1995)
                      10. Farscape (1999-2003)
                      11. Star Trek: Deep Space Nine (1993-1999)
                      12. Serenity (2005)
                      13. Star Trek: First Contact (1996)
                      14. The Matrix (1999)
                      15. Battlestar Galactica (2003-present)
                      16. Star Trek: Enterprise (2001-2005)
                      17. The Wild Blue Yonder (2005)
                      18. Futurama (1999-2003)
                      19. Star Trek: Generations (1994)
                      20. Back to the Future (1985)
                      21. Bis ans Ende der Welt (1991)
                      22. Star Wars Episode III: Revenge of the Sith (2005)
                      23. Lektionen in Finsternis (1991)
                      24. The Fifth Element (1996)
                      25. Galaxy Quest (1999)
                      Last edited by Lope de Aguirre; 05-05-2007, 09:26 AM.
                      My UHD, Blu-Ray and DVD Collection


                      • #12
                        My Faves

                        Originally posted by Joe Nazzaro View Post
                        Nothing against any of those projects, but let's wait to see if they stand the test of time.
                        I agree. It takes a long time to figure out the impact of anything. I'm old enough to remember when V the Series was going to change TV sci-fi.

                        I also think it's silly to mix up movies and tv serials. They are completely different animals. V, for example, worked very well as a mini-series (i.e, a long movie) but stunk as a TV series. A successful series can make a transition to movies (i.e., Trek) but it's rare and it builds on the series.

                        As for top TV series, I don't know how I'd order them, but my list would probably be Star Trek TOS, Firefly, X-files, Doctor Who (both versions), Blake's 7, Red Dwarf and, of course, B5. Buck Rogers might make it as a guilty pleasure (see Gray, Erin) but I would never admit it in a public forum.

                        Oh, wait...

                        Of the series out there now (I've not watched Lost, is it really sci-fi?), I would say that BSG will perhaps be on the list one day. But it will take time for it to finish and digest before we fully grok it's impact.

                        The cool thing about B5 is that it's impact is still growing. I just turned my rabid Trekkie brother and my non-sci-fi wife onto it (they both LOVE it). I'm trying to get my sister into it. And I just found out my Dad watched the original run. It's very encouraging that this show seems more popular now than during its original run. That's rare. And very very special.

                        Ratings don't matter nearly as much as passion. In ten years, no one will remember American Idol. But people will still watch reruns of the shows they truly love.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Hal_10000 View Post
                          , Doctor Who (both versions),
                          ok, this is a little thing, but from the purist standpoint there are not 2 doctor who series, the argument goes in multiple ways
                          1 its 1 series including the fox movie (i happen to subscribe to this, doctor who IS ONE series)

                          the other is that it is 10 series counting eact actor who became the doctor

                          eccs stint is season 27, tennet is 28 and 29 and will be 30


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Lunan View Post
                            ...X-Files (not a scifi show by the way)...
                            Maybe not in the Bizarro universe where YOU come from!


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by raw_bean View Post
                              Maybe not in the Bizarro universe where YOU come from!
                     is debatable. X-files is more of a horror genre. Just because some freaky monsters happen to be called "aliens"...I don't know if that really constitutes as hard sci-fi for the most part. But then...a lot of things don't if you push the definition too far. That said <3 my x-files.

                              This list drives me crazy, but I can deconstruct their mentality. Throw in a buncha hip new stuff. Lost...Heroes! Yeah man! Next, throw in some pop culture classics like Back To The Future, Terminator. Everyone then nods and says "yeah, I can see that..not my favorite, but makes sense..." Then you have to throw in a couple to appease the real sci-fi nerds..Blade Runner...Serenity..Check! Last, you pop in a semi-obscure one to give your list some street cred. Brazil! Top 25 compiled!

                              I'm in a funny mood today. Maybe because I just drank too much coffee.
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