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  • #31
    Let's hope he will manage to clear it up, and without him being "set off" this time.

    And I had the same thought as Jan, I thought that the actual "meat" of what he said was in the part of his post I quoted in this topic start. So I took the liberty of quoting that too, in a reply (which I'm sure will appear soon enough).

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    • #32
      Originally posted by Shabaz
      Let's hope he will manage to clear it up, and without him being "set off" this time.
      Hope so. I really hope they've reached an agreement.

      And I had the same thought as Jan, I thought that the actual "meat" of what he said was in the part of his post I quoted in this topic start. So I took the liberty of quoting that too, in a reply (which I'm sure will appear soon enough).
      It's up now. Hopefully JMS will read them and respond.

      Jan
      "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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      • #33
        I didn't want to post the whole thing, and I did inlcude a link. As far as what those who don't click on the link get, I thought this was more than sufficient to represent the new claims:

        This, however, is just the tip of the iceberg. After having spoken at some length with the Great Maker, Mr Straczynski, a new range of official novels and Babylon 5 encyclopaedias will be appearing next year.
        I frankly thought that was less hyperbolic, and less likely to set JMS off if the post weren't 100% accurate in every way, than this:

        I can now reveal that we have been engaged in talks with Mr Straczynski, and the entire range will now be approved by him - right down to every word, comma and technical detail.
        Geez - even the Del Rey novels, for which he wrote the outlines, were not approved to this degree by JMS. What is wrong with this guy?

        Which is quite frankly why I deliberately omitted that part and hoped that no one else would bring it up. (Or open another thread or even respond to my post until after JMS did.) To play fair I had to include the link, but I could also hope that JMS would be too busy to read all that and would content himself with my shorter version.

        Regards,

        Joe
        Last edited by Joseph DeMartino; 12-09-2006, 02:44 PM.
        Joseph DeMartino
        Sigh Corps
        Pat Tallman Division

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        • #34
          Well, at least this time Matthew's speaking in terms that can't possibly be claimed to be misunderstood. That's one reason why I tend to think it's true.

          As for setting JMS off, he's never shot the messenger...yet.

          Jan
          "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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          • #35
            I can see your reasoning Joe. And I apologize for being the one that brought it up anyway.

            But, in the initial bit you quoted he only states that 1) he talked at great length with JMS, and 2) that there will be official novels, which they already were without JMS's involvement and with WB licencing's approval only. While it might be more likely to "set off" JMS if it is false, the second part you quoted of Sprange's statement is what I think got the "fan circles" excited, and it really contains the statements that I kind of wanted him to comment about. If there is still a conflict and it was all a lie, then it might indeed set him off, but in the process also informs the fans of the extent that Sprange is miscommunicating to us. If it is true however, and Sprange is maybe overstating the extent of the details of the deal, than JMS would need those details to clear things up to us in the most accurate way possible. He can't clear up what he doesn't know about, or isn't asked about.

            Anyway, my intention wasn't to "set off" JMS, or to stir things up in the business relation between him and Mongoose. I honestly thought you might have forgotten to quote it, and didn't realize you intentionally omitted that information. While I know that there is a history there and that JMS happens to be a man who knows how to hold a grudge, I think he is mature enough to handle small inaccuracies and some marketing hyperbole, and if it is more than that and there are gross inacuracies in Sprange's statements about him, that he would appreciate being informed about them.

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            • #36
              I can see your reasoning Joe. And I apologize for being the one that brought it up anyway.
              Oh, no need at all to apologize. I don't own the newsgroup or the subject, and wasn't trying to lay down the law on what should and shouldn't be said. I was just trying to explain my thought process in posting what I did (and didn't.)

              As for setting JMS off, he's never shot the messenger...yet.
              Well, he's never killed one, but he has been known to wound them from time to time. I could show you scars.

              Joe
              Last edited by Joseph DeMartino; 12-09-2006, 03:35 PM.
              Joseph DeMartino
              Sigh Corps
              Pat Tallman Division

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              • #37
                That was a case of mistaken identity, though, wasn't it?

                Jan
                "As empathy spreads, civilization spreads. As empathy contracts, civilization contracts...as we're seeing now.

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                • #38
                  So do we have information as to whether this information is valid? Sorry for the silly sentence.
                  Flying Sparks Web Comic - A Hero and Villain In Love. Updates on Wednesdays
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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by SmileOfTheShadow
                    Sorry for the silly sentence.
                    I know someone's gonna have a field day with that sentence too. *Glances over at Amy.*
                    Flying Sparks Web Comic - A Hero and Villain In Love. Updates on Wednesdays
                    True Believer Reviews: Comic Reviews and Interviews on Wednesdays and Fridays - Or Your Money Back!

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                    • #40
                      JMS hasn't posted on the newsgroup yet, so no new info. And after a quick glance at their forum, no new info from Mongoose's side either.

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                      • #41
                        Amy will ignore the silly sentence in favor of posting JMS's reply, instead:

                        Subject: Re: ATTN JMS - Mongoose Books?
                        From: [email protected]
                        Date: Today 11:12 PM
                        Newsgroups: rec.arts.sf.tv.babylon5.moderated


                        Joseph DeMartino wrote:
                        > There is news up at the Mongoose publishing site that has generated
                        > some discussion in fan circles - to say the least. Naturally this
                        > happened just when the newsgroup went pear-shaped and it became
                        > impossible to ask you about it or see anything you might have posted on
                        > the subject yourself.
                        >
                        > Given the controversy earlier this year on this newsgroup, there is a
                        > lot of skepticism on the 'net about this announcement, especially given
                        > that the newsgroup, your main means of publicly communicating with your
                        > fans, was effectively down.
                        >
                        > Can you, or will you, offer any coment?
                        >

                        I've tried several times to reply, but each time the server ate it,
                        let's see if this one gets through.

                        To recap...after making a number of rather controversial statements
                        about my involvement, which were not accurate, there were several
                        emails exchanged which resulted finally in my agreeing to give Mongoose
                        a second chance. The main concerns were that a) information given to
                        the fans should be accurate, b) the books should be canonical, and c)
                        the level of writing on the books had to be consistent with what's gone
                        before. To be fair they said they would work within the guidelines
                        they were given.

                        I made it very clear that I did not want any money off the deal, no
                        fees for myself, the purpose was to ensure the quality of the books.

                        The manuscripts came in on the books currently in progress, and
                        unfortunately the level of writing is at very best amateurish, on a
                        level somewhat below what one would find on the average fan-fiction
                        website. In some cases the manuscripts had net handles not even actual
                        names, they were unprofessionally put together and edited, and the
                        writing is just not there. This is not the sort of thing that can be
                        easily corrected with just some notes or asking for re-dos. They
                        haven't done much publishing in the area of fiction previous to this
                        time, and my feeling is that as well-intentioned as they might be, they
                        don't really have the chops when it comes to fiction. And their
                        statements on their website are again somewhat overstating the
                        situation and not being entirely accurate in the projects and processes
                        being announced.

                        So having given a second chance to this process, and again as well
                        intentioned as they may be, my sense is that this is going to be a case
                        of diminishing returns. Fiction is a far more subjective field than
                        putting together reference books, and you really have to trust the
                        tastes and perspective of your editorial staff, which for me,
                        subjectively, isn't here. So I've stepped back and said I really can't
                        be a part of this process because I can't endorse something if I don't
                        think the quality is going to be there. So it's between them and WB at
                        this point.

                        jms

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                        • #42
                          I can now reveal that we have been engaged in talks with Mr Straczynski, and the entire range will now be approved by him - right down to every word, comma and technical detail.
                          Apparently, not so much. There goes the "he wouldn't say it so emphatically if it weren't true" theory. I suspect that Sprange posted his note after he had spoken to JMS but before he had actually submitted any of the manuscripts for his review - that he just assumed that JMS would approve what he was sending. That's the most charitable interpretation I can come up with given the contrast between the two messages.

                          Regards,

                          Joe
                          Joseph DeMartino
                          Sigh Corps
                          Pat Tallman Division

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                          • #43
                            I'm sure that I'll be able to find something else to spend my money on instead of these books then...



                            (Oh yeah. I got this wedding thing coming up, don't I?)
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                            • #44
                              I wonder how Claudia "Ivanova" Christian is going to take this. She is one of the authors.
                              Andrew Swallow

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                              • #45
                                That's really disappointing. And I'm baffled that he wouldn't have waited until JMS gave him feedback before making such definite statements on their public forum. But I guess this is a case of "fool me once", and my own fault for believing him. Oh well, guess I'll just go back to my usual mode of ignoring these type of books, like I do with most other tie-in fiction.
                                Last edited by Shabaz; 12-12-2006, 09:20 PM.

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