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Vision Delenn - WWE 2

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  • rallytbk
    replied
    Time travel explained, lol.

    Now it's now, and that's all that is. You remember yesterday, but that is a memory occuring now. The past doesn't physically exist. Nor does the future. The only real (i.e. existing physically) part of our time perception is now.

    Spaceballs-
    Dark Helmet: What the hell am I looking at? When does this happen in the movie?
    Colonel Sandurz: Now. You're looking at now sir. Everything that happens now, is happening now.
    Dark Helmet: What happened to then?
    Colonel Sandurz: We passed then.
    Dark Helmet: When?
    Colonel Sandurz: Just now. We're at now, now.
    Dark Helmet: Go back to then!
    Colonel Sandurz: When?
    Dark Helmet: Now.
    Colonel Sandurz: Now?
    Dark Helmet: Now!
    Colonel Sandurz: I can't.
    Dark Helmet: Why?
    Colonel Sandurz: We missed it.
    Dark Helmet: When?
    Colonel Sandurz: Just now.
    Dark Helmet: When will then be now?
    Colonel Sandurz: Soon.
    What ya think?

    Leave a comment:


  • rallytbk
    replied
    Originally posted by SLerman
    Ivanova knew Sheridan's codes, and tells him he should change them more often. à Anna knows about this "quirk of personality" as wellà but sometimes the simplest answer really is correct.
    Originally posted by FuryPilot
    She *could* always knock. If the old lock code still worked, fine. If it didn't and she jacked the lock fine.

    FP

    I totally agree with these statements. My wife can gain access to my accounts within five different codes that I have reused over the years. Sad to admit it and lazy of me too, but creating new codes for accounts is a pain. So the simplest answer really is the easiest to accept for me.


    Originally posted by SLerman
    As for Delenn's flash forward, she may not remember it any better than a dream. And if it was that bad of a dream, she may have (understandably) assumed that it wasn't real and purposely tried to forget about it.
    Originally posted by rallytbk
    Deja-vu is always noticed after the event have passed, IMHO, She had no control of her vision/flashback or the chain of events leading to this situation...
    Hey anything is possible, but is it plausible? IMHO, I think it was possible for Delenn to experience both the events as a dream and as a Deja-vu once the even came to passed. Reading anything more into it would open up other possible situations.

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  • SLerman
    replied
    Originally posted by grumbler
    I like this better than the "Sheridan's lock code was the one that Anna knew" answer. How could Anna POSSIBLY have known ahead of time that this would be true? Would she really have gone to his quarters just assuming that she knew the code?
    Ivanova knew Sheridan's codes, and tells him he should change them more often. If Ivanova knows the Sheridan never changes them, it's not a difficult jump to assume that Anna knows about this "quirk of personality" as well. It's fun to come up with bizarre, interesting ways of Anna getting into Sheridan's quarters, but sometimes the simplest answer really is correct.

    As for Delenn's flash forward, she may not remember it any better than a dream. And if it was that bad of a dream, she may have (understandably) assumed that it wasn't real and purposely tried to forget about it.

    Leave a comment:


  • Garibaldi's Hair
    replied
    Of course another explanation for Delenn's reaction when Anna walks in and says "Hello", is that she is so shocked BECAUSE she realises that she saw this in her vision in the time rift.

    Leave a comment:


  • FuryPilot
    replied
    Originally posted by grumbler
    I like this better than the "Sheridan's lock code was the one that Anna knew" answer. How could Anna POSSIBLY have known ahead of time that this would be true? Would she really have gone to his quarters just assuming that she knew the code?
    She *could* always knock.

    (I could post this version of the scene if anyone is interested in seeing it. An alternate scene in written form should not count as a story idea, especially since we are discussing the scene already)

    Personally, I really don't care how she got into the room. She was pulled out of a Shadow cruiser and "restored" to as close to her previous personality as the Shadows could manage -- all with the express purpose to get Sheridan to Za'ha dum. If the old lock code still worked, fine. If it didn't and she jacked the lock fine.

    And as to why Delenn didn't see this coming -- very simply, she couldn't -- because if she did it would spoil the whole effect it had on the audience.

    And that explanation is good enough for me.

    FP

    Leave a comment:


  • grumbler
    replied
    Originally posted by vacantlook
    Maybe the Shadows gave Anna some technology that easily broke the lock similar to what Morden had when he entered Kosh's quarters in "Interludes and Examinations".
    I like this better than the "Sheridan's lock code was the one that Anna knew" answer. How could Anna POSSIBLY have known ahead of time that this would be true? Would she really have gone to his quarters just assuming that she knew the code?

    Leave a comment:


  • grumbler
    replied
    Originally posted by DeMonk
    You do not need to BELIEVE. You might simply be curious as to the identity of the person. I know I would have been.
    But she does not really see the person. She is looking at the glass, a female voice says "hello" (and the person saying it is haloed by the light from the corridor), she drops the glass, and is whisked away.

    Pretty disorienting, and not condusive to lucid recollection. I have always been convinced that when it comes to prophecy Joe is showing us more than he is showing the charactors - it is a trademark of his.

    Leave a comment:


  • rallytbk
    replied
    Originally posted by FuryPilot

    Ivanova to Sheridan in Divided Loyalties: "I let myself in. You should change your lock code more often."
    And Furypilot swoops in and solves the access issue, lol. Good catch really.

    Deja-vu is always noticed after the event have passed, IMHO, so it is possible that Delenn didnÆt expect Anna Sheridan to walk in that night, but had knowledge of the event from her flash forward in time, which as WillieStealAndHow stated before, Delenn had a WTF moment during the event and realized after the fact her vision/flashback happened as she saw it in WWE. She had no control of her vision/flashback or the chain of events leading to this situation... this is why I loved this show and watch its subtle references to possibilities if there is a production sometime in the future.

    Now some visions didnÆt happened as it was expected, example: GaribaldiÆs recording of Ivanova (some say it could have been B4 in the past, who knows) and/or Jeffery SinclairÆs flashback/escape vision with Garibaldi fighting (also possible B4 connection), but only because the main characters appeared in ôSleeping in Lightö this scenario remains to me as wishful thinking and a long shot then another plot twist to this already great show.

    [ReplyÆs Welcomed]

    Leave a comment:


  • FuryPilot
    replied
    Originally posted by WillieStealAndHow
    Or that Sheridan never bothered to change his door code throughout his career
    Ivanova to Sheridan in Divided Loyalties: "I let myself in. You should change your lock code more often."

    FP

    Leave a comment:


  • vacantlook
    replied
    Maybe the Shadows gave Anna some technology that easily broke the lock similar to what Morden had when he entered Kosh's quarters in "Interludes and Examinations".

    Leave a comment:


  • David Panzer
    replied
    Or that Sheridan never bothered to change his door code throughout his career

    Leave a comment:


  • rallytbk
    replied
    I know I am coming in late to this thread, but hereÆs my two centsà

    While it is known (to the viewers) during WWE 1+2, that the characters experienced brief flash backs and forwards in time, it is also assumed that they didnÆt know when in time they were in, let alone grasp what was happening around them. To my knowledge John Sheridan was the only character told how many years (forward or backwards) his jump took him?

    If we take what we have with Delenn's jump, and look for when it could have happened or why Delenn didnÆt associate that night with John to be anything more than a night with John. By this argument alone that ôshe should have known this would happen that night and why she was surprisedö. It would you assume that she knew the exact moment of AnnaÆs return, her decision to ignore it and her questionable surprise to be faked to follow the timeline is guessing at best. It is impossible to know when something is going to happen unless someone tells you exactly when it is going to happen and why?

    To me seems to be an incredible amount of hindsight which is impossible for anybody to know. Even if Delenn knew Anna was alive and that she would return, wouldnÆt her reappearance surprise her the moment she returned? Even if Delenn knew more or less she would return in the future? What would be considered ôThe futureö?

    Note: Today is the 6th of February 2006, if I tried to remember what I ate for lunch on the 18th of August 2003, (which by the way is an insignificant date to me) my mind goes blank. I canÆt remember what I had for lunch last week let alone know what I had that day. If you knowà you have a better memory than me.

    With this I find DelennÆs reaction to be genuine and following through with what already happened as she saw it, and remembered as the flashback moment.

    As for Anna Sheridan access to JohnÆs quartersà I assume that John never removed or modified the ships records to reflect her death. She was always listed as missing and her card key allowed her to gain access to her husbandÆs quarters as it should. Nothing special here. Only that things happened as they said will happen. Nobody really knew when ôin timeö it will happen.
    Last edited by rallytbk; 02-06-2006, 01:55 PM.

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  • vacantlook
    replied
    Maybe Delenn's reaction became less of a "crap this is happening" and more of a "crap this is happening now!?"

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  • Jan
    replied
    But if she didn't believe, that explains why she wasn't prepared for the actuality when it came. I imagine that the 'watching over Sheridan sleeping' might have triggered a sense of deja-vu' but if she didn't believe in the vision she probably hadn't thought of it much after it happened.

    Jan

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  • DeMonk
    replied
    Originally posted by Jan
    Stands to reason that she *would* have if she'd actually believed in her own vision, right?
    You do not need to BELIEVE. You might simply be curious as to the identity of the person. I know I would have been.

    Leave a comment:

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